Atheists vs Theists by Júlio Carrancho - HTML preview
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Julio: Ahmad S, can you show us the document that establishes you as the official spokesman for Al ah?
Vinoth K: Ahmad S, just say a guy is very good character, pure in heart but doesn’t believe in god. Will he still be punished?
Ahmad S: Vinoth K, yes he wil .
Vighnesh K: Vinoth K, body becomes sinless. Genetical y. Then only they enter no matter how religious.
Julio: Vinoth K, if the guy is a very good character - and I believe he is
- Al ah will punish him double for being superior to him, Al ah. Al ah -
likewise Yahweh of the Jews - is a very jealous god, and does not accept rivals, so be warned.
Vinoth K: Ahmad S, wow. So your god is evil, punishing good guys... Are u ok with this?
Julio: Personal y, I never did any wrong to Al ah, so I am counting on his goodwill and understanding. Am I expecting too much...?
Youssef M: Julio, can i know why you have this hatred toward Al ah and islam? I feel from your comments this huge negativity but why? What happened?
Julio: Youssef M, it’s the tree’s bad fruit for centuries. What about you? Do you admire that tree? I don’t hate Al ah, and have been on good terms with 187
IT. No problems with Al ah, none; only have problems with his admirers pretending to represent him, and ready to commit evil to protect him.
John C: I’m not worried about al ah, I worry about radical, extremist islamists with evil and darkness in their hearts ready to commit crime to protect Al ah. Gods don’t do anything, people do.
Julio: John C, yes, the fanatical, criminal islamists you mean...? Will Al ah forgive them, or will they be dropped in the eternal jahannam?
Maxwell S: Al ah doesn’t exist.
Julio: Thing is, if Al ah will not forgive atheists, who will?... Other gods are as much dysfunctional as this one from the Arabian Desert. I maintain that Al ah will sympathise with atheists when they will tell him about al the bad fruit those who shouted him great produced for 15 centuries, what do you think about this? “Hey, Al ah, I’m an atheist simply because of the bad fruit your admirers produced for fifteen centuries, did you know?”
“Okay, Julio, understood: I will fix them!”
Lena S: No, because he’s a fictional character.
Wes C: No ... he is a myth.
Naas D: I’m not worry about al ah, just a few of his followers, acting like crazy dicks. I’m more worried about them.
Donna S: Couldn’t give less fucks about any of these imaginary sky wizards.
All a load of brainwashed horse shit.
Peter N: Al ah is imaginary. The imaginary cannot forgive.
Molnár R: God is so egotistic so he will get furious if you do not believe in him. Or if you cross a total y unreasonable rule of his as wel . This is how 188
dictators work.
Julio: Al ah’s character was damaged and denigrated by his admirers, which Al ah shall not forgive. His admirers that daily shout he is great etc, will face Al ah’s intense wrath and displeasure, the result of which is unimaginable chastisement and pain in Jahannam, hel , immediately after the judgement of the Last Day; it will be horrific for muslims; atheists wil laugh at them, haha. It will be terrible. Al ah does deeply in his nature abhor hypocrisy and pretense of piety. He is furious against his admirers pretending piety while being altogether the opposite. Even Al ah’s favorite prophet exclaimed that Jahannam [the islamic hell] is filled to the brim with muslims, those billions that throughout the 15 centuries pretended to be pious while mocking piety. Al ah can never excuse them, and their punishment will be the worst disgrace they will ever face for all eternity and beyond. Will Al ah forgive the atheists for not believing in Al ah?
Natural y he wil , simply because of what turned an intelligent student an atheist: the bad fruit, toxic and poisonous, that Al ah’s admirers produced for centuries of pushing and selling Al ah, which Al ah detested, and consequently one day tired and nauseated took up to punish his admirers for all that ugly yielding. And all atheists will be happy in Paradise forevermore!
Dave J: Al ah cannot forgive anyone as he only exists within the minds of the theists!
Vidar L: No, he had to exist to do that.
Julio: Why is it that you always have the right answer?! LOL!
Vidar L: lol
Mark R: No. Al ah will divide by zero and destroy the entire universe because of atheists’ smug disbelief in him.
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Durga E: First of al ,why is Al ah allowing the killing of innocent people by muslim terrorists in his name?
Eliza S: Nonexistent, made-up characters in stories can’t forgive anyone.
Julio: Al ah is the god of muslims created in the Arabian Desert about 15
centuries ago, a wild beast with no patience for arguments about why he demands admiration.
Derrick E: Julio, you clearly missed the point.
Bob M: The more important question is whether or not believing in invisible spirits is a sign of mental illness, or merely a confused mind?
Julio: Bob M, it also has to do with a low IQ, one hears. Intelligent folk tend to discover that religion is a poisonous tree of toxic fruit or the other way around.
Jed K: Atheists do not need to be forgiven anything.
TristanJc J: I’ve not read every religion under the sun, but I doubt there are many that accept atheism. The reason is they don’t follow the manipulation and may lead people away (so they ignorantly believe) i doubt it. And I’m saying this as an atheist.
Peter G: More importantly, will atheists forgive the damage done in the name of al ah?
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25 – What leads a believer to turn atheist? [1]
96 comments
Julio: Intelligence, firstly; then the horrible bad fruit believers produce.
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Jeff Cox: As a moderate evangelical, I am sad to say that many times it is the hypocrisy they see in the church.
Julio: Jeff C, wow, what do you mean by “moderate evangelical”...?
Jeff C: Julio, i am a conservative when it comes to theology. But I would be considered liberal on social issues like lgbtq rights etc.
Trenton P: Jeff C, thank you for reminding me that there are some Christians who are trying to make a positive impact on society and not just bul y us.
James R: Jeff C, as a moderate evangelical, I would be cautious when speaking for atheists. Is this what you have heard from atheists? If it is, how do you know they were being honest with you? Have you ever mentioned to them that this is your pet peeve? If it is not out of the mouths of atheists, could it be your projection onto them?
Mick J: Simple, read the Bible.
Jarret T: Unreciprocated life experience. Faith not rewarded or reinforced.
Contemplation of one’s world view conflicting with one’s existential beliefs.
Mick J: Like I keep telling you the Bible is the source of much atheism.
Jen R: was I ever real y a believer ? Or was I just behaving as though I was because I had been taught from my earliest age?
Joseph J: Common Sense.
AR B: Actual y reading the Bible. The brainwashing they receive from birth being unable to compensate for their intelligence. Real facts and 191
evidence clashing with the primitive ignorance of the Bible. Watching something like the school shooting event in Uvalde and realizing the god character is a monster or doesn’t exist.
Ilona T: Start thinking for yourself, using logic, reason and common sense.
Trenton P: Many things, but for me it was a process of meeting the divine for myself and then studying science instead of wasting my time with scriptures. The Bible never gave me the answers I sought. As I grew in wisdom I began to understand that the religious world was holding everyone back, and that led me to reject religion and its conception of god.
Julio: Trenton P, you’re certainly an intelligent student - makes two of us, proudly.
Trenton P: Julio, thank you for the compliment; I do believe that everyone is capable of developing their intelligence and I hope more people choose to do so.
Jim F: The sil y implausibility of Christian claims.
Chris U: Reason over faith, plus knowledge of self.
Justin M: You start questioning what people try to force down your throat.
Kevin M: The mind. When we think we are something we are not.
Richard A: For me it was education.
Noddy D: Richard A, I find much irony in your comment.
Russell V: That’s a great question. For me, it was far too many questions 192
concerning the discrepancies and logical inconsistencies of the system of religious thought I was being asked to accept. I started asking those questions many decades ago, when I was still a teenager. I asked parents, teachers, clergy, friends, everybody. No believer could provide satisfactory answers. The problem resulted in a crisis of faith on my part. It bothered me so much that one day I final y decided, just as a thought experiment, to give myself permission to pursue my doubts and follow them wherever they may lead. What happened next was almost instantaneous. The entire house of cards col apsed in my head. Even though I had strong social motivations to try to put it back together, I simply could not. At that moment I realized not only that I no longer believed, but that effectively I never real y did. Admitting that to others brought on all kinds of scorn and abuse, but I must tell you, admitting it to myself was a huge internal emotional relief. To this day, I still haven’t found anybody who can provide meaningful or compelling evidence, or who can even come close to answering my questions. But of course I always remain open-minded.
Mary T: All sorts of things. A natural disposition to atheism that comes with life experience, abuse at the hands of a religion, sometimes even it’s a phase of rebellion.
Mark A: Laziness most of al , they don’t take the time to actual y read the Bible before being dismissive.
Trenton P: Mark A, that’s rather prideful to presume. But the more I see of your comments the more I see words that push people even further away from god and Christianity. So thank you for making my work to dismantle organized religion even easier. You need peace in your life, a peace that allows you to accept that people have different beliefs than you.
Mark A: Trenton P, “the Bible is not god.” In a literal and figurative sense, it’s not because it’s simply a record, a compilation of what god might have said for mankind, which is transcribed and then translated to the best of our ability. As I said from the start, just in this group alone you see 193
atheists twisting verses and making vulgar memes purely out of mockery, whenever we see their obvious error, we’re supposed to have the capacity to correct them if it’s not consistent with what we know... unfortunately, you said that we should just drop the idea of trying to understand what the Bible is trying to say since it’s nothing but a waste of time... it’s quite obvious that you’re the one who needs to listen and change here. It would have also made more sense if you said that you were once an atheist, feeling empty all your life... but to say that you were once a believer then somehow gained wisdom by dropping the knowledge you gained from trying to read the Bible is simply... flat out illogical... be honest with yourself for once.
Trenton P: Mark A, I real y hope you find the love of god. You deserve peace and happiness. You deserve to be free of the compulsion to judge and condemn others with different beliefs.
Mark A: Trenton P, I’m not the one who strayed from the truth... I’m just pointing it out, you’re being identified based on your actions which is neither judgement nor condemnation... someday when you realize this fact, I hope it’s not too late... as I said, you can change but that is all up to you.
Trenton P: Mark A, it’s understandable that you want to convince me that your religious beliefs are correct. It seems that your faith instructs you to convert others or you will be punished. I hope you free yourself from the abusive religion you choose to follow.
Julio: Mark ended his dispatch with a threat “I hope it’s not too late”. This is the judgmental bad fruit these victims of religion and fanaticism use to try to scare the antagonist. Mark, what powers do you have to issue threats to people debating religion with you? Do you represent some dictator that asked you to threaten your adversary on subjective religion?
Nobody needs religion to be a decent person.
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Paulina C: Valuing truthfulness, honesty, evidence, learning to discern fact from fiction and critical thinking. I don’t like lies, or making something fictional because one doesn’t know the answer, and saying it’s true. A good clue to the fantasy of religion and its lies is reputable science of over 50 years repeatedly and consistently finding prayers do not work as promised in religion, and the impossibility of life after death.
Rick M: Bagging and backstabbers and hypocrites in the church.
Trenton P: Rick M, yes, it does seem like the majority of people claiming to be Christians have very bad moral character. It raises the question, just how potent is their faith at helping people become better?
Lindsey B: Just saw the nonsense peeking out of it so I went in and dug in and studied the Bible and saw how utterly baseless it all was and it was so painful the leaving, but you understand when you can “unsee”
something? I couldn’t unlearn the stuff I saw in the Bible, couldn’t ignore the impact it had on me, just couldn’t unsee the horrors within its pages.
Brian C: I suspect the most common cause is anger that their prayers were not answered, but then there may have not been a true believer in the first place. However I am a believer in prayer, which can bring good results.
Julio: Prayer doesn’t bring good results when you pray for the MISSING
CHILDREN. Try it and see for yourself.
Trenton P: Brian C, I’m impressed at this low-key elitism. Please keep presenting such demonstrations for the public to see. It will push even more people away from your religious beliefs.
Brian C: Trenton P, like I said they were not true believers in the first place. A true believer in religion does not change because prayers are not answered. I am not saying that all prayers are unanswered as praying can 195
bring about good results.
Trenton P: Brian C, please help me understand why you choose to believe that.
Brian C: Trenton P, because of the comments I have received from Atheists on this site. I once asked the question why did believers become atheists later on and a number of them told me that they had been disappointed from God not helping them, but I suspect they were not a strong believer in the first place. Their replies had not changed me from being a believer in God. I have had many reports from believers that have had help from God.
Trenton P: Brian C, I can agree that using unanswered prayers as a major reason for becoming an atheist does seem a little intellectual y weak. Yet, I don’t know what their prayers were about. We don’t know if they were praying for their loved ones to survive, for their housing to be secure, or for abuse they experienced to stop. I’m just not comfortable saying that they were not “true believers” in the first place. It’s like saying they deserved bad things because they didn’t completely agree with a religion.
If we start thinking like that, it’s a slippery slope to religious persecution.
James R: Brian C, you are someone claiming to know what happens to people who you have no understanding of. A poser and a pretender thou art.
Brian C: James R, I said “I suspect” which is taking a guess and not knowing for certain the reason.
James R: Brian C, you are posing as one who knows the heart of another and pretending you know when you say, “there may not have been a true believer in the first place.” As far as your suspicious nature is concerned, it is beneath contempt.
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Brian C: James R, look up the word “suspect” sometime.
Eliana R: They realize that their religion was bull but instead of turning to the real God, the God of Israel, they give up probably because they prefer sin.
Trenton P: Eliana R, that kind of attitude real y turns me off towards the god you mention. It seems faith makes people into arrogant and haughty people.
Eliana R: James R, sin is the intentional transgression of commandments-if they like doing that they prefer sin.
James R: Eliana R, if I find God I will ask Him about that.
Eliana R: James R, u do that.
James R: Eliana R, I can understand why you are no longer a Christian.
“Judge not, lest you be judged” was just too much for you.
Eliana R: James R, actual y I judged myself and realized I didn’t follow God’s commandments and started to - I real y don’t care what others think of me I never have.
Michael N: Realizing that prayers go unanswered.
Peter H: Common sense and a good dose of rationality.
David K: Wanted to start a brothel.
Jorge T: Julio, reading the Bible has turned many theists or Christians into atheists. The Bible can real y be helpful.
James R: I have three reasons: 1) The contrast in the many miracles in the 197
distant past and no miracles in the present. 2) My inability to understand faith. 3) Sexual assault committed by religious leaders.
Kevin J: I didn’t leave because I saw hypocrisy or because I was disappointed that prayers weren’t answered. I left because it is based on faith.
Glenn B: Theism is not something I choose. It’s something I realized.
Claudie P: When I realized that my first experience with fear was within religion. That’s when I questioned the belief.
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26 – What leads a believer to turn atheist? [2]
100 comments
Joe G: Realizing it’s a myth.
Julio: Intelligence, firstly; then the horrible bad fruit believers produce.
Then there is the thing about believing in “Invisible Things” - Hebrews 11:1 [KJV] - they believe the worst absurdity, the idiots. It does lower the brain cell count for sure. It is a dishonouring battle, which can change a winner into a loser - that story of believing in “Invisible Things”! I say this with tears in my eyes, because some are loving, sincere folk, although some other ones arrogant as hell and surroundings, and bloody violent if not worse. Religion is brain stagnation, paralysing brain cel s by the millions. The result, intellectual dwarfism. Religion imposes its beliefs in invisible things, and attacks you if you ask what things.
Mike D: Common outweighing indoctrination.
Chuck Y: Actual y reading and thinking through the Bible.
Julio: Good answer; it happened to me.
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Jeffrey D: Julio, “The Road to Atheism is Littered with Bibles That Have Been Read Cover to Cover. Andrew Seidel, Attorney Freedom From Religion Foundation.”
Alexander W: A desire to suppress the truth.
Graham A: Reading the Bible?
Steven G: Reason, logic, an appreciation of reality and scholarship.
Donn H: I’ve never believed in any sort of magical sky god.
Glenn H: I was only about 8 or 9 - it just seemed to be part of growing up and getting a more mature sense of how myths and stories develop.
Jimmy S: Glenn H, except that to some others, you never real y grew up, yes?
Glenn H: Few say that - one or two on FB debates perhaps. There aren’t those tensions in the UK and hardly anyone brings up religion.
Tim E: The Bible. This is the reason medieval Christians fought hard to prevent the Bible being translated for the masses. It exposes the lies.
Paul P: Actual y it was a Christian friend, a very good friend at that, who made me become an atheist. His name was Ray R. a paramedic in Winnipeg who currently works for STARS. If it wasn’t for him I would still believe. But he turned me from religion. Since then I truly have researched religion and gods and empirical y know that there are no gods whatsoever. So in a weird way I owe it to Ray, a devout evangelical fundamentalist, for ending our friendship and making me a strong atheist.
Ray S: Sanity.
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Dino S: Bertrand Russel .
Mark H: Reading the Bible usual y.
Mark M: Education, information, rational thought, common sense, etc.
Jimmy S: Mark M, so atheism is something you are led to?
Mark M: Jimmy S, in my case, no, but there are those that could benefit from those practices mentioned. People are led to religion, by having it forced upon them.
Dino S: I go to church every Sunday for work. Nice people mostly. Some bigots. Why do they go to church every week to hear the same Jesus died for us story? Yeah, we get it. If I were the son of God and I could save all being crucified.... What’s the big deal? I’ll do it.. that’s nothing.
Jameson Z: Unanswered prayers.
Leahne M: Critical thinking, I would assume. For many, once they realise that the definition of their particular favourite god leaves it an impossibility, the indoctrination starts to crack. I hear it’s a very difficult realisation and journey for lots of people. I’ve spoken to a few who realised that “the one true god” almost always seems to correspond with its popularity in a specific geographical area - and that opened their eyes.
Jed K: Education and acquired wisdom.
Robin W: Common sense is a very overworked phrase.
Ben J: Diverse study, intellectual curiosity, honest self-reflection and critical thinking, broadened horizons/experiences, logical analysis, etc.
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Mahmoud B: There is only one true religion; most atheists turned from Christianity, but they don’t try to look for the true religion which I believe is Islam.
Rich C: Mahmoud B, what makes it true?
Mahmoud B: Rich C, that is my belief, you can read Quran and judge it yourself.
Julio: Oh, no, another delusional muslim telling us to read the quran! It is because I read it that I rejected this horrible cult from the Dark Ages.
Mahmoud, get lost, don’t post here again or I will block you, last warning!
Rich C: I’m an atheist. No god(s). No Al ah. It’s just an old book, written by old men. You’ve been deluded. That is my belief.
Gaz H: Mahmoud B, I’ve read most of the Quran. It’s a hard read. A lot of it feels like it was written by a child. I have to admit getting most of the way through it and being absolutely underwhelmed by it. I’m surprised I got so far.
Wil y W: Reading the Bible cover to cover made me one.
Harry K: A friend had good results with psychotherapy.
Rich C: The realization and final y the acceptance of reality.
Alvin N: Reality and reading the Bible or Koran.
John H: Rational appraisal of the claim for the existence of God.
Darwin P: For me there was a gradual destination between my phenomenological experience and my rational choice to believe that there was an objective reality outside of what I was experiencing. It placed 201
all of my thoughts regarding the proof of god’s existence in a framework of choice and so required no external proof. When I no longer needed to defend a belief in an external god, because it was a choice… god became unnecessary. And my mental gymnastics sort of cleared up... like adolescent acne.
Begen J: Trump supporters helped make a lot of atheists by posting on Facebook. Trump has done so much to destroy Christianity. The only thing Trump was good at was being a true Christian, haha.
Jim L: They final y wake up from their childhood indoctrination and use their brain to realize that it is all crrraaaaaaaaapppppp.
Julio: The intelligent folk have an advantage in the process.
Jimmy S: Jim L, so you’re led along a path to atheism, huh? Indoctrination is something people “wake up” from? How convenient an outlook.
David F: Rational and critical thinking.
Keith M: I figure bad water, been poisoned, or brain damage turned most into atheists, such a sad situation.
Judah M: Because the Bible says if you believe in you will get everything you want so it is the opposite then.
Peter P: They realize religion is all of it pure bul shit. I was 9 years old when I turned an atheist.
Katherine R: Honest and unbiased examination of the reasons for believing in any God.
Tom A: Emotionalism is what I see by most atheists in these kinds of forums.
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Martial H: Education, critical thinking.
Ben C: No relationship with God. They got butt hurt by people, and then they blame God.
Maxwell S: When you question about the fables in the Bible and no one can give you a proper answer is what turned me an atheist when I was 11
years old. All they say is to not question about the Bible.
Wes C: Reading the Bible all the way through turned me into an atheist.
Garry D: Going through all the scriptures eventual y turns one into an atheist. Eventual y you realise they’re all the same garbage loaded in different trucks. When you have morals you don’t need religions to do good deeds; you just do it because it makes you happy, simply because you’re a good person; that’s it.
Jim G: No such thing as an ex Christian.
Ian P: Jim G, only a person who has been cured of the God delusion.
Jim G: Ian P, no such thing as an ex Christian.
Ian P: Jim G, so people who are Christian are doomed to remain insane?
There is no cure?
Julio: Jim, you are a delusional Calvinist, haha! Those who remain prisoners of a religion end up losing a lot of brainpower and turn ugly fanatics or worse.
Dustin B: Asking the right questions and not being satisfied with the answers.
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Em D: Knowledge and Understanding!
Ron C: Question everything and don’t believe because somebody says so.
I wasted 30 yrs. Question the Bible; I did. It has nothing to offer.
Mark C: Education.
Wayne G: Honesty, which was not required for becoming a theist.
Mk E: Seriously? A challenge. You are told as a child that god will be there for you. Then he isn’t. Then you question faith. Then you read everything that you can to understand your faith. Then you realize it makes no sense.
Then you realize it’s nonsense. Then you feel guilty and depressed about the loss of faith. Then you accept it as life. Then you embrace it. Then you realize all that nonsense is, in fact, nonsense.
Julio: Very well put. But it is a very difficult exercise to escape the rut of religion, and many victims will never succeed in escaping it, sadly.
Schmarshin S: They get butt-hurt because the babies didn’t get what they wanted.
Leonard C: Sufficient accumulation of unbiased facts.
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27 – Why do believers disappoint in moral matters?
41 comments
Julio: The other day, one of them called me Satan, only because I asked why his God didn’t answer prayers for the MISSING CHILDREN. What’s wrong with these believers’ morals? The other time, a pastoress, for the same reason, called me “uncircumcised philistine”! Jesus called his antagonists Satan, dogs, pigs, swines, sinners, uncircumcised, enemies of 204
God, demons, Marxists, Dracula, etc. His admirers follow him on insults.
John J: Julio, well “Satan”, I’d frankly rather talk to you than to the man in the sky.
Mary T: Julio, but are you Satan…? I’ve heard she’s a good pretender.
Noddy D: Julio, you were insulted? Oh no! Many are insulted every day; it’s Facebook, not the end of the world!
Julio: When I gave this individual an opportunity to apologise and demonstrate that he had Christian principles ruling his life, he again misfired and revealed he was another low-morals fanatic. These are the characters that objectively characterise their religion as a rotten egg to throw away.
Sharon C: Julio that Bible can screw your brain up if you let it. And they have!
Friedrich W: Yes believers in the atheist religion are very disappointing in moral matters. Lol.
Julio: Friedrich W, your comment registered as insolence. Don’t do it again.
Friedrich W: Julio, i am just confirming that your OP is true for the immoral atheist religion. Lol. “In a materialistic universe, there is at bottom no design no purpose no evil no good nothing but pointless indifference...” Richard Dawkins. Julio what then do you mean? Is that related to the immorality of atheism? Or another topic?
Paulina C: Friedrich W, you expose your ignorance of what theism and atheism are. Not a complementary look.
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Maxwell A: Because believers are also sinners. Being a believer doesn’t mean you’re a saint. And most of today’s believers especial y in western society don’t realize there’s maturity levels of Christianity. It’s a journey towards righteousness, and a believer will stumble like an infant as they learn to walk on the narrow path.
Julio: Maxwell A, so, are you saying that you don’t need to be a believer to be a decent, moral person?
Maxwell A: Julio, well those are your words, but I will agree with it. Yes you don’t need to be a believer to be a decent person. just being kind to others doesn’t take a believer to do.
Julio: In many instances, even the mature believer makes use of insults and threats to confront the antagonist. And in many cases and situations, it is the mature and spiritual believer that applies the most violent language to try to scare the antagonists, like calling them ugly names and condemning them to an eternity of torment or worse. Are you one of them?
Paul L: Because the scriptures they consider sacred are immoral.
Julio: Indeed, the holy books they sell are very immoral, full of lies and stories about thieves.
Paulina C: Julio, good question. I do know a few believers that are repugnant individuals, and nobody wants them near. One might ask that of the “Christian” Russians invading and killing their neighbouring people of Ukraine, as we speak! I’m just pleased I am not religiously associated as a Christian with that abject cruelty.
Sharon C: Because they’re human like the rest of us and they’re worshipping a god that’s not there. No one can prove any god exists outside of their holy books and feelings. You are brainwashed and programned to not 206
question a thing in the Bible. You believe willful y blind by it, but there’s not one ounce you can prove except your feelings. I was not born bad.
I was born a blank slate that got imprinted with religious mind control bul . I’ve never been happier or more productive of a person since I don’t believe it.
Gift L: Sharon C, believe what, Sharon?
Sharon C: Gift L, it’s as if you don’t read or comprehend a thing I’ve said.
You don’t want to know why I’m an atheist, you just want to try to save me, so you can brag at church how you “witnessed” to a mean old atheist and get patted on the back for it. I’ve seen it al , lady. I’ve seen and heard it al . It’s bul shit.
Gift L: Sharon C, the truth will set you free.
Sharon C: Gift, fuck off.
Gift L: The Bible explains it as acting after the flesh. Thus Jesus says that you must be born again. Natural instinct vs spiritual instinct.
William P: Because believers falsely believe their system of morality is superior when it is objectively not.
Kenny D: They think they have the authority of morality, because it’s given to them by some deity.
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28 – Bible study: Why did Peter kill Ananias and Sapphira?
52 comments
Frank P: Peter didn’t kill them. They fell down and died. The implication is that Yahweh killed them. Peter’s role is that of the prophet, declaring 207
Yahweh’s judgement.
Julio: Frank P, who exactly told you that story...? If the writer has no credentials the students can hold on to, then the story is spurious and false. I’ve looked at this ugly story from all angles and read all the standard commentaries about it. There are two important questions the unbiased student asks: [1] Who got this information to the writer of Acts and, [2]
what happened to the money Ananias dropped at Peter’s feet. For thirty years I asked this second question to Bible teachers and others, to be mocked and disdained.
Frank P: Julio, or it is not intended to be a factual narrative but rather a moral tale. In a story, it’s perfectly reasonable to start the analysis within the story-world. Julio, I understand the wish to analyse the context the author worked in, but it’s hopeless here because we have no information about the author. No date, no identifying details, nothing except internal evidence. While he claims to have consulted sources, he doesn’t tell us which ones. So straight away, we’re inside the story. What if there was no Theophilus? It is a device.
Lindsey B: Seems like many claims were made to con people into believing. We have too many mistranslations and misappropriation of Hebrew scriptures claiming them as “messianic prophecies to take the Bible seriously.”
Kenneth M: Frank P, the only problem with that, is that the prophets stopped with John the Baptist.
Frank P: Kenneth M, who told you that story? Agabus was one (Acts).
Also Paul endorses prophets. Many examples.
Kenneth M: Frank P, Jesus told me in Matthew 11:13 and Luke 16:16 and it is reaffirmed in 1 Corinthians 13:9-10. People hearing the word of god is much different than prophesying in the ways the prophets of the Old 208
Testament did.
Julio: ... and Paul was also a false prophet, clearly visible when his most prominent “prophecy” turned into a flop: about Jesus returning in his days. Paul was also a very dangerous fanatic. Acts 5:1-11. Most Bible teachers will not explain this passage properly.
Noddy D: Julio, he didn’t kill them.
Julio: Avoid talking baloney by trying to explain that the couple was killed by some holy ghost. It wasn’t. There are two very strong clues in the passage. Use your brain to find them.
Noddy D: Julio, ok, you show them because I believe you are very much incorrect.
Brian K; God killed them for lying, just as God is going to send all unrepentant liars to burn forever.
Julio: Peter lied about not knowing Jesus, six weeks before he murdered Ananias and his wife for their money!
Frank P: Brian K, it sounds as if you approve of this system. Can you tell me why such a being would be worthy of respect in any way?
Frank P: The story of Ananias and Sapphira is a good example which shows how feeble it is to defend an NT-only “ethical teacher” view of Jesus. Here’s old Yahweh from the OT dishing out vengeance from above.
If we can recognise it, surely the original listeners must have been able to. So we can link it to all we know from the old times. And Jesus brings nothing new. He’s not disowning anything, in fact he’s going to be number two in the cosmic tyranny. Or number one, depending on your analysis of the Trinity.
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Brian K: Frank P, an accurate analysis. Jesus does not bring anything essential y new. Jesus is in perfect doctrinal agreement with the Old Testament YHWH who He claims as His Father. You are looking at it more honestly than most “Christians”.
Julio: Not once in the canonical gospels does Jesus ever refer to Yahweh or the Tetragrammaton as his father; only if you are a Russellite fanatic.
Daluxolo K: I think it’s not a matter of staying alive or dying, but it was God’s power which caused all that to happen.
Julio: That’s irrational. Peter had committed a worse violation when he denied Jesus in front of a few ladies, using coarse expletives not mentioned in the narrative. And the same “holy ghost” let him go unpunished. Peter was a big liar, and a big thief, and just a few hours earlier Jesus had called him Satan. Most fundamentalists avoid real Bible study, because that would destroy their fundamentalism.
Diana M: Julio, it might represent a threat by the church to not withhold money for yourself. They weren’t honest about their willingness to sacrifice all worldly possessions. They withheld some money in secret.
The moral lesson is that they both died, and the money they had kept to themselves didn’t benefit either of them.
Joel G: Peter didn’t kill them. It doesn’t say that! But, how did Peter know what was going to happen? That’s what makes the story bul shit. Also, where is that church today? It doesn’t exist and it didn’t exist then!
Julio: Joel, and what happened to the cash?! Who took it? The story is a big lie, impossible to have happened. According to catholic exegesis, Peter was right there elevated to the authority of supreme Pope, the first in a long list of successors with a history of crime to this day, to this very hour.
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Christopher J: It was due to communism. You see, whenever communism comes around, people start dying over money. The same happens in the Bible with the communist Christians like Peter. Communism is not good because communist leaders always end up killing people over power and money. You see, Peter was a communist who served a communist dictator named Yahweh, and that communist dictator killed them when they lied about money they were expected to give to the commune. That same communist dictator is guilty of committing mass genocide against children, so such nasty crimes should be expected of him.
Julio: That’s correct. Peter was always a criminal representing a criminal gang of thieves to this day. He was an immoral character, and still his.
The Bible, including the New Testament and all in it, represents a system of thieves, liars and criminals, no exception for any of those actors in the whole story.
…
29 – What about prayers for the MISSING CHILDREN?
71 comments
Julio: Why doesn’t your God answer prayers to find the missing children?
I can tell you why, but believers reject my answer.
Brian C: Maybe he does, as some missing children have been found.
Julio: Brian C, why some? Other children are not loved by your God? ...
waited a while for Brian to answer, but he didn’t.
Brian C: Julio, because I don’t answer right away means I have other things to do and I might be asleep in bed due to the time zone between different countries. So because you don’t get an immediate reply from me does not mean I have refused to answer your question. If you don’t get a response within 2 days then ask your question again. Julio, God has his 211
reasons and no one knows what his plans are. We all would like to know the answer to your question.
Julio: Brian C, so, what answers to what questions do you know? How do you know that God has his reasons, did he tell you? Did he tell you what his reason was not to answer important prayers? Next time God talks to you, tell him that I asked you to ask him what type of prayers he answers.
Brian C: Julio, I can tell in your reply that you are very anti-God so there is no reason in continuing to reply to you.
Julio: Chicken; goodnight!
Dave H: Brian, some? Didn’t the rest deserve it?
Brian C: Dave H, but should we be blaming God for every bad thing that happens in the world. I don’t.
Julio: Hey, chicken, not everything! Are you an immoral person?! The missing children issue is not “every bad thing”, you insensitive fanatic!
Get lost, and don’t post here again or I will BLOCK you! Your God is a miserable midget, insensitive and incapable, and you support him with your money! Do not post here again, go to hell!
Dave H: Brian C, but God witnesses every child rape and murder with indifference. If I was him I’d stop all of them with a thought. That’s why I’m more moral than your god, Brian.
Brian C: Dave H, imagine a world where nobody dies by accident and no one commits a crime or does anything evil. That would be a fantasy world.
God does not exist to take orders from people. He considers requests. All we can do is pray and hope.
Julio: Brian, I ordered you not to post here again, didn’t I?! Now you 212
post crap as if you spoke for or represented God here! You are total y delusional, insincere, and a fraud. Last time I order you NOT to post here again! Go to hell!
Dave H: Brian C, so we are supposed to love him in a universe where he’s created bone cancer in children, autoimmune diseases, malaria etc? If this god is real, which I very much doubt, then I owe him nothing except spit in his eyes. His actions aren’t those of a loving parent, they’re the actions of an abusive, psychopathic, petulant teenager with infinite power. Even if you could provide evidence of such a being I’d refuse to kneel to it.
Maxwell A: What missing children?
Julio: Maxwell A, check the list in your town.
Maxwell A: Julio, I’m from Auckland NZ. I don’t think I’ve seen missing children reports here.
Julio: Maxwell A, it’s a lovely country, beautiful, been there. Had lunch in the Sky Tower. Little crime, but there is some. Missing children too.
Check with the police.
Jamestone W: Missing in your own eyes not in the eyes of that god you are pronouncing. Remember you are calling him “god” meaning he knows the way about everything he created.
Stacey R: Jamestone W, then he would be a psychopath.
Jamestone W: Stacey R, is that the only name you can give him?
Stacey R: Jamestone W, absolutely not. There are many more I could throw out.
Russell V: Then he was fine with the holocaust?
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Jamestone W: Russell V, well he knows that already before you are.
Russell V: So that’s a “yes?”
Jamestone W: Stacey R, then you are the psychopath if you don’t have one name for that. Check!
Stacey R: Jamestone W, the typical toddler mind of a theist.
Julio: Jamestone W, you misfired a lot with your comments. Let me warn you to stop your nonsense, or I will block you out of here. Otherwise, tell us how many missing children were found through your prayers. Your comments reveal how cold and sinister your heart is, how dark your soul is. You are following Jesus insulting his friend Peter calling him Satan!
Jesus was bad and you admire Jesus?... If you don’t apologise that shows how low in morals you are. Good night.
Jamestone W: Julio, do you think Satan should be romancing in any bad attitude by asking apologies to his disciples? No. Night is good only when you pray before sleeping, because your life is in god’s hands when you are sleeping. I hope you remember before sleeping!
Julio: Jamestone W, you sound stupid. It’s sad that your morals are so low.
If you are the preacher in your pictures, then you are a bloody liar pretending to be pious. I would never invite you over for tea and biscuits in my rose garden. I don’t appreciate religious hypocrites. Good night.
Jamestone W: Julio, it’s so sad that your morals are high but in emptiness, I will not agree to taking tea in the rose garden of evils, because man shall not lives by tea alone. How do you know hypocrites if you don’t know god, but I believe you know god but in secret, and that is hypocritical.
Julio: Your morals stink, sir. No testimony of a decent person from you.
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Sad that you don’t understand. It’s people of your type - low-morals -
that keep intelligent folk away from your religion. You had an excellent opportunity to apply good morality here, apologising for your rudeness, but you failed. No tea & biscuits for you. Good night.
Dave H: Jamestone W, that’s a disgusting statement. Seeing as god isn’t showing up to look after them I think their parents saying their children are missing is the only relevant perspective, eh?
Jamestone W: Dave H, saying their children are missing doesn’t mean they are happy for that to say god doesn’t exist for that, no. The love of their parents to them still have hope to meet them someday or somewhere even after death if they are dead, so how does that work? It means the love of their parents to them is not dead because those children are missing, no. No parents on earth that love their children will ever believe that he or she lost their child to vanish forever, no. So they always have hope that one day they will meet their lovely child, meet where! If they don’t think that life after death as god believers that there is another life in god’s name, amen.
Julio: stop posting here, you talk rubbish. If there was a God he would never ask you to speak for him. Last warning!
Stacey R: They don’t care because they think these poor kids deserve it because of “original sin”.
Julio: Stacey R, I know. It is a religion of fanatics with no brains. Their God a dislocated, dysfunctional midget, made of recycled plastic, good for nothing.
Angelique K: He’s an absentee landlord.
Lindsey B: Perhaps because he was created by hunter-gatherers to explain whatever, mystify or terrify them, or whatever they felt could kill or 215
control them.
Michael C: Duh, because he’s omniscient and shit, and he already knows where they are.
Kenneth B: The “all-seeing, all-knowing” claim is bogus!
Jim F: God is too busy deciding who will win the football game.
Alan H: None of his business, your concept of what you think God should be doing ie solving every problem. He gave us the choice, we chose sin, sin is down to us, atheists are the biggest sinners on earth - just ignore them and their rude pedantic harassment.
Reuben G: Because he’s very entertained watching how they are raped.
Paulina C: Authentic research over many countries over the last 70 years has constantly found prayers are not answered at al .
Julio: Prayer is total y disproved when desperate believers pray for their missing children and the result is zero success. Good night.
…
30 – The Rapture: I bet $20 it will not happen this year! [1]
85 comments
Julio: Besides, this Rapture event is only for believers, I heard. No
“disbelievers” or unbelievers will be raptured. The matters is rather complex: [1] If you are not a believer you will not be raptured; [2] If you are not raptured you will stay around for a while; [3] If you are raptured you will be snatched up to heaven; [4] and once snatched up you will not come back. Those not raptured will face a difficult time. Those raptured will be blissful in Paradise. But nobody knows when this event will take place. I am prepared to bet twenty bucks that it will not happen until 216
December 31 this year.
Kenneth D: I bet 50 that it will not happen for 50 years.
Julio: Kenneth D: Let’s keep the bet low, just in case.
Mick J: You simple-minded idiot.
Richard A: I doubt a Christian will take you up on your bet.
Julio: Richard A, man, it’s only a twenty, why not?
Richard A: Julio, because they don’t believe it either.
Alexander W: Where does the word rapture show up in the Bible? It doesn’t say that word anywhere.
Julio: Wel , that’s not a problem, is it? The word transubstantiation is also not mentioned, but the Pope uses it daily.
Chris L: Thessalonians, new testament.
Walt W: Chris L, nope not there either. Kind of hard to create a doctrine on less than 10 verses found nowhere else in Scripture and written down by Paul under crack or hashish.
Chris L: It’s a stupid side note in Thessalonians, a compilation of various bullocks after the documents compiled to form the new testament; it’s from a single note of providence.
Norm D: Chris L, Thessalonians is not from Jesus. Thessalonians is the opinions and doctrines of men.
Chris L: None of it is from Jesus, he died.
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Alexander W: It’s not in the Bible, even in Thes.
Julio: Alexander W, the word Trinity is also not in the Bible. Do you believe in that story?
Alexander W: Julio, I don’t believe in the trinity. I believe in Jehovah God his son Jesus. The Holy Spirit is not a third being: it is God Jehovah’s Holy course power energy love that he puts out or into someone.
Julio: Alexander W, ah, so you are a Russellite, a JW!
Alexander W: Julio, no; I’m nondenominational.
John W: Julio, the trinity is ful y described in the Old and New Testament.
The idea of the rapture is not found anywhere in the Bible.
Julio: John W, hahaha, ful y described in the OT! Show us.
Julio: Alexander W, non-denominational ... it’s sad to sit there without denominations. Borrow twenty bucks from a friend and bet. Maybe you’ll end the year with some denomination. Won’t you try?
John W, Julio, the OT says God is invisible. There are numerous examples of God taking a visible (often human) form. The OT talks about God’s Holy Spirit. There you have it. The trinity in the Old Testament Julio: Alexander W, no it’s not there; you are making it up, don’t do that, or I will call you dishonest!
Dan V: Jesus was very clear about his return in the gospel. He’s 2000 years too late. He promised his return soon after his death, and Paul’s letters confirm that to those he wrote to; he said that the time is short, and he believed he would be alive when the end comes. Jesus’ cult is made of 218
2000 years of last days. All those victims of Jesus and Paul are long dead, and still no Jesus.
Jim F: Alexander W, the Bible doesn’t say, for example, anything about there being a Roman guard at the tomb either. The Bible makes no mention of many things that Christians have decided it suits them to declare it true.
Alexander W: Funny dude. Laugh it up, life’s a bitch and then we die.
Have a lovely god-blessed day.
Joseph J: I got 20,000 that it never happens at al .
Julio: Joseph J, man, that’s risky, is it not? Keep it smal , just in case...!
Richard A: Julio, lol!
Érick T: I bet $20 that it will happen, but it’s Christian evangelists who go to hel , and it’s us atheists who go to heaven and who have been chosen.
Julio: Érick T: Haha, they will get very angry!
Dean B: That nonsense is not even biblical, because Christ comes after the Great Tribulation, not before Matthew 24; second Thessalonians 2.
Richard T: I will wager $20 against a dozen dough nuts, it won’t happen in 5 years.
Julio: Richard T, so, you love dough nuts? Makes two of us!
Mary T: But if you’re wrong, how will I collect?
Osiris B: I have my lifetime income saying there is no such thing lol.
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Alexander W: No one knows when anything is going to happen, even us Christians. Won’t know the day nor the hour. The only thing all go by is how bad the world’s getting just like before the flood. People were warned, and didn’t listen. It’s getting a hundred times worse today than it did then. But all we can do is keep eyes and ears open. Watching the prophecies slowly come true and to pass. Example: turning good bad and bad good.
Jonathan W: I bet 40 it won’t happen in the next 10 years.
Gary J: Safe bet.
Russell V: Creationists: “I’ve never seen a species change within my lifetime, therefore evolution is a lie.” Also creationists: “The Second Coming will happen! It’s only been 2000 years; be patient!”
Robert B: I bet $10,000 it won’t happen in our lifetime (I’d say never, but that can’t be verified)
Brian C: Robert B, if it did then you lose your money and all your possessions and have no use any more for them. So it’s a sil y bet.
Robert B: Brian C, or you can study the Bible and see what “rapture”
and “the return of Christ” is - or is not - and understand that they were promised for that first century generation of Christians, and not for us, the ignorant Christians of 2022. So I’m sure my bet is the safest ever.
Justin M: I’ll get in on that. But I want to sweeten the deal. I got another $10,000 that says it doesn’t happen next year either.
Arun C: Lol that’s an easy bet to win.
Alan F: I used to be a bus driver. My passengers would shit themselves if I was suddenly raptured.
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John O: Let’s just hope your bet is right?
William P: I’ve got $20,000,000,000 that it won’t happen ever.
Julio: William P, wel , I would not risk so much money, just in case!
William P: Julio hey, if I’m wrong then money is the least of my worries.
Julio: William P, I think you’re right, nonetheless, lol.
William P: Julio, it’s just a shame that I’m not an eternal being so I’ll never be able to collect my winnings.
Joel G: I bet my soul it’s bul shit, too!
Norm D: The rapture isn’t even in the Bible. It’s a doctrine of men. You all should spend more time doing what Jesus said to do and stop talking about crap dreamed up by bored men with time on their hands. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world... (Matthew 24:14) But it never was. Try doing that. Try preaching the “gospel of the kingdom in all the world,” as Jesus said to do. Oh, you don’t even know what the “gospel of the kingdom” even is? Wel , that’s a problem, huh?
Jesus preached it and Christianity lost it.
Kenneth M: If you believe in rapture I’ve got some ocean-front property to sell to you in Arkansas.
Julio: Kenneth M, hey, ocean-front in Arkansas, hahaha! Are you drunk, LOL!?
Duarte C: I’ll go double on that.
Mark A: There’s no such thing as a rapture anywhere in the Bible... this is 221
a new age crap that was recently made up.
Julio: Folks, go to your church this Sunday and tell the congregation that Julio wants to bet $20 with each one sitting there that Jesus will not rapture anybody this year, and see how many stand up to bet. Thanks.
Brian C: If it does happen then you’re going to lose your money anyway, along with everything you own.
Joe B: Brian C, everyone will see Jesus when he returns.
Familia D: That’s convenient. If it happens, you won’t have to pay. If it doesn’t, we pay.
Alexander W: Whatever happens money won’t mean shit.
Rod S: Why $20? You should up it to at least a million dol ars. Every year these Christians claim that the Judgment Day is coming and it never happens.
Julio: Rod S, correct, I could bet a million, but 20 is all I have at the moment, hard times. And yes, believers keep pushing the date forward to save face. Chickens!
…
31 – Jesus wants to save you! What do you say to Jesus?
[No swearing, please!]
108 comments
Arlette T: No, thank you.
Graham A: Save me for or from what?
Julio: Graham A, haven’t you heard?...Wants to save you for the Celestial 222
Choir, not interested? Haven’t you heard about the Celestial Choir?...
Everybody knows about it, why don’t you?
Graham A: Julio, I must have been in a different country. I have asked people in my street; they don’t know about this either. What celestial choir? How do you know this?
Julio: That is the famous choir in heaven everybody saved by Jesus will take part in. Every saved soul will join the Choir. There will be choir practice daily, except weekends or public holidays. Time for practice will be from 8 AM to 12 PM; then a 2-hour break for lunch, and choir practice from 2 PM to 6 PM, every day. From 6 to 8 dinner will be served, and from 8 to 10 PM, relaxing time, playing cards or chess. Lights will be turned off at 10 PM sharp.
Graham A: How do you know this information?
Jun D: Julio, and you are not kidding or made this shit up. In that case a psychiatrist will help you join the choir and learn the games.
Ray S: I’m fine, don’t need Jesus.
Julio: Ray S, no salvation for you, therefore...?
Ray S: Julio, the last frickin thing I want.
Tim E: Can he save us from Christianity, please?
Jonathan L: Demonstrate that Jesus existed.
Julio: Jonathan L, who, me? No time, sorry.
Molnár R: I think this is a theoretical question.
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Bo A: Jesus has been dead for 2000 years. Don’t think he can save anything.
Jun D: Bo A, he was never alive ever; no historical books were written during the time he was “alive”.
Jim G: Do you want us to believe that Jesus of Nazareth was a real guy in Palestine? Not you, but anyone with an education that’s honest yes. There are no respected scholars pushing mysticism today. That’s an outdated ignorant fiction. Even Christianity’s worst critics recognize the fact of a historical Jesus.
Soetiran K: “If the person offering you salvation is also the one threatening you with punishment, it’s not real y salvation, it’s extortion.”
Leahne M: Assuming you mean the version of Jesus where Jesus is also god; “Now you’ve confirmed you are not omnipotent and omniscient, can you please try to let everyone else know that?”
Steven G: Go away, imaginary man.
Jun D: I’m not stupid to believe in fantasy.
Julio: Jun D, good answer to Jesus!
Jun D: Julio, that’s my answer to you, believer of fantasy.
Courtney F: People have to save themselves. If Jesus existed then I wouldn’t have to put up with so much bul shit.
Glenn B: Religion seems to be just assumptions.
Andrés C: It very much depends on what he wants to save me from.
Carlos C: “Wait, dude. You want to save me from what exactly?”
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Dave J: I would say I need to get my head checked as I’m having a form of psychosis by talking to an imaginary character, which has created an hal ucination within my mind.
Michael P: Can he save me money on my car insurance if I switch? I won’t promote which company, but here’s a completely unrelated photo of a reptile.
Molnár R: “No thank you”. I don’t like to be an ass with people, but if God or Jesus is how they describe him to be in Abrahamic books, then I don’t want anything to do with him even if he exists.
Brandon A: Reveal yourself to me in a way which I cannot deny, then I will happily go along.
Dustin B: I say that Christianity is an immigrant religion that systematical y took over. It does not reflect my cultural heritage and belief system. If you want to worship Jesus that is fine with me. Just don’t shove it down my throat or we will have a problem.
Jon A: You’re fired!!! There was no Virgin Birth. The word used was almah which was “Young” in Hebrew. Then the Greeks got ahold of the story and it suddenly became “Virgin”; strange, eh? The thing is, if the authors had wanted to say it was a Virgin, they would have used betulah which is Hebrew for “Virgin”. When you couple this with 2nd Peter 1:20, it means there was no Virgin Birth as we don’t get to interpret it - it says exactly what it was meant to say. There is no Afterlife, because after nearly 2 centuries of scientific investigation and experimentation, we have a very finely granulated view of what parts of the brain do which things.
This part does math, that part remembers the names of colors, that part allows both hemispheres to talk back and forth, that part allows you to remember the names of your relatives. You can damage each part, one at a time and you lose a small bit of cognitive ability. Yet the religious people 225
want us to believe that when the entire brain is damaged at death, that we are somehow brought back whole at the Pearly Gates with our intellects intact, remembering grandma, what shade of blue to call that, and how to add 2 and 2. It’s a preposterous concept. Wishful thinking in it’s purest form. Then there is simple logic. So, God is omniscient and omnipotent.
Please explain why he would have created a garden that needed tending to start with. According to the biblical account, the only reason Adam was created was to tend the garden created by God. So after creating the garden in such a state as to require tending, God compounds his error by creating Adam in such a state that led to Adam getting lonely, further requiring God to address this new error by creating Eve to keep Adam company - and we know where the biblical account goes from there.
Frankly, the God of the Bible isn’t fit to work at McDonald’s drive-thu given his record.
Vidar L: he wouldn’t understand Norwegian.
Jun D: Vidar L, you know it, let the stupid believers find out their stupidity.
Rio R: Why the make believe game?
Peter G: I don’t talk to ghosts.
Salvatore C: If he real y were able to save anyone he should have passed on the correct rational philosophy that would have allowed mankind (word includes women) to communicate a way to live without using force or killing one another to get what is necessary to survive.
Peter W: No thanks. I’ve heard how your Dad watched over his beloved
“chosen people” and I want no part of such misery and suffering. I am not stupid enough to take a chance on your empty promises either.
Jun D: No fictional character in the Bible and the movies with 3 identities can make or save anyone no matter how many believers picture him as 226
real. The one who’s getting saved is Jesus by the church and its die-hard followers and they are making money off of him.
Antonio M: Sorry dude but I don’t have an imaginary friend in the sky.
Janis A: Nothing, he is fucking dead.
Jun D: Janis A, or he is an image fucking the hell out of humanity.
Eliza S: Janis A, never real y existed; fucker was just a character in a book.
Wes C: Lots of preachers named Jesus roaming around Palestine 2k years ago. Doubt that any of them were the messiah.
Michael G: Biology disproves Adam and Eve. Richard Feynman said, “We (scientists) are trying to prove ourselves wrong as quickly as possible, because only in that way can we find progress. This is the opposite of how religion works - disregards any evidence which is unfavorable to its belief in an attempt to convince believers and others it’s true. This is why thousands of religions exist and why science works.”
Chad B: Save me from what? Seems like the only thing I need saving is from Jesus.
Ken W: I don’t hear Jesus. I hear you and other human voices saying this Jesus exists. I know those other voices may have convinced themselves of this existence so I am wary.
John T: Isn’t he just “saving” us from his own wrath? So, hey Jesus, maybe knock off with the wrath crap and everyone gets what they “want”? Right?
He can choose to save whomever he wants.
Eliza S: No thanks. I don’t need saving; I have known ppl who definitely needed saving but “god” just ‘looked the other way’ like my mom, a 227
devout Christian who wanted to help people while trying to be “godly”
and got killed by someone who “needed help” but just wanted money.
People like me who tried to be nice to someone said in a bad spot in life but almost got killed, but instead got stuck with brain damage and people treating me differently because of it. I definitely could have used some saving that day.
Jasane P: Save me from the hell he created for me in the event I don’t love him? Not interested in an abusive toxic relationship.
Moses J: Jesus saves; fake book and posts that don’t reflect my view.
Chris D: Jesus is a symbol for the manifestation of truth embedded in the mushroom Amanita muscaria, which possesses you i.e. you become Jesus; highly poisonous. You are “possessed” by the spirit of the lord. ‘He”
wants to “save” you from delusion and those who bear false witness so that you can perceive Reality or God or the Logos and be at one with the universe. It’s all bul shit stuff.
Darin B: Fuck your salvation. It’s neither needed nor requested.
Spare V: Jesus is fake.
Begen J: Take meds because the rape baby terrorist ain’t real. When they caught the terrorist Jesus, he was with a nude boy the Christian Bible says, Mark 14:51-52.
…
32 – Why isn’t Atheism more popular than Religion?
116 comments
Julio: Is it that victims of religion prefer superstition to effective intelligence?
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Syed T: Julio, I think there are no superstitions in a true religion, it’s the people who believe in superstitions.
Julio: Syed T, are you defending the flying horses of Islam? Did you know that there were flying horses in the 7th century of the Dark Ages across the Arabian Desert...?
Syed T: Julio, flying horse is not a part muslims believe in general. The word “Buraq” used in that verse is derived from “Burq” that in Arabic means lightning. There are different interpretations from different scholars. Science tel s us light is the fastest thing in the universe and if traveling at the speed of light would be possible in the future, we will get the answer for this question.
Julio: Syed T, baloney, horse manure. All muslims believe their favorite prophet was superstitious and maybe too much hashish fumes got him to see the “horse”. How can you folks believe stories without any proof?
What’s wrong with you? Tell me, was your favorite prophet almighty and perfect, or was he a regular human being capable of telling lies and fabricating stories he also believed from other storytellers? And why would you need this guy in your life, honestly?
Syed T: Julio, why would we need him to follow? There are many books written on him and I’d suggest you read them. There’s no place for superstitions in Islam. Ignorant Arabs were superstitious and Mohamed was against superstitions.
Julio: By the way, Syed, you are misfiring badly, so let me warn you about the possibility of being blocked from here for talking baloney.
Mark M: With education comes truth.
Julio: Mark M, of course. Take the example of a religion where victims have to believe superstitions about flying horses from the Dark Ages!
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Obviously, not a sign of great intelligence in the 21st century. When I hear of those victims of religion pushing that coarse fable of flying horses from the Dark Ages I shake my head in disdain, and lament how low human intelligence can descend, is it not to lament?... No atheist believes in flying horses from the Dark Ages, and the reason is the use of a good intelligence they are blessed with.
Mark H: Give it time.
Glenn H: I suspect there are more atheists in the UK than religious people
- a lot seems to depend on the region. Many - in other regions - seem to be scared of Hell so just claim to be religious out of fear. You’d likely need to discuss each country and context separately.
Julio: Glenn H, yes, take Saudi Arabia, where to be an atheist is a crime.
What does that say for the level of intelligence in that country? Or is it something more sinister?
Hammad B: Julio, huh I just happen to have a faith that this cannot be a coincidence, everything is perfect in its nature so which of his favors will you deny? Aren’t there enough signs?
Julio: Hammad B, are you saying that you can be an atheist in Saudi Arabia and have all the freedoms muslims have over there? Is that what you mean?
Hammad B: Julio, sure I like to think so, humanity is above everything.
Julio: In Saudi Arabia, everybody must believe in flying horses to be a happy citizen.
Jim M: Indoctrination. They mostly make it up as they grow to fit their own moral code. Every theist worships a different god.
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Jim G: It is a religion. You’ve been corrected a dozen times.
David K: Jim G, rofl, like a true theist, not listening to evidence that disproves your mindset... atheism is a religion like baldness is a hairstyle.
Jim G: Raymond D, you’re wrong. Read more, talk less. Who would better know fiction from reality? A fiction writer? Are you freakin serious? So you’re a Scientologist, cuz L.Ron Hubbard…… “knows….” And Hubbard has created cutting edge DVD exposes on the perils of psychology and ECT therapy. And your point is? And “reasons clown” Richard Dawkins thinks life came to earth on an asteroid because his brain is tucked in his posterior orifice. Awesome.
Raymond D: Jim G, apples and oranges between Clarke and Hubbard, now both food for the worms.
Jim G: Raymond D, so you’re an atheist? You believe everything got here how?
Julio: Jim G: All came from “Nothing” and will return to “Nothing”. Do you know why? Jim, I already warned you a few times not to misfire, or else you will be gone from here, is that what you want from this august audience?
David B: Faith in gods is more comforting.
Julio: David B, how much of that faith do you have?
David B: Julio, about zero.
Steve F: Because there are way more gullible, dumb people, that’s why.
John K: We didn’t have as many swords as you had to convert people.
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Dániel K: Because it’s still a relic of the past. But we are getting there.
Wayne G: For every truth there can be countless lies.
Toxofilite T: It’s funny, but the more educated people are getting, the less people are believing in gods.
Peter D: Toxofilite T, the whole reason we have had the vast increase in knowledge is down to the Scientific Revolution and the development of Philosophy both of which grew uniquely (as attested by any historian of Science or Philosophy) from Christian influenced Europe. All the people who began the Scientific Revolution were believers and were motivated by this belief in their scientific inquiry. The modern fad of non-belief in God and the thus necessary denial of the logic that what appears to be designed actual y was designed, has no basis in Science. The philosophy of Scientism or Logical Positivism has been taken up by many scientists and has been mistakenly accepted by them as if it were an inherent part of their Science. The possible stagnation of scientific theory caused by this blinkered thinking with regard to the Universe was avoided by the contribution of the Christian physicist Lemaître of the idea mentioned in the Bible that Steady State was incorrect and that the Universe had a beginning. The Bible constantly warns against pride - “Pride comes before a fal ”. I would suggest that pride on the part of some in their increased knowledge rather than education is the reason for the increase in Agnosticism and presumed Atheism.
Peter D: Julio, you have got this wrong and yes I do do my historical research. You are wrong in assuming their faith was a matter of coercion.
People just did believe and they were not tripped up like so many these days by the blind faith leap from the logic that what appears to be designed most probably was designed, into the abyss of randomness and uncertainty necessarily brought about by its denial as a consequence of disbelief in God. Copernicus and Galileo were forced to be cautious not because the church was anti Science but because it like most thinkers 232
up to then adhered to Aristotelian Science. All the other great thinkers, Kepler, Newton, Descartes, Pascal, Boyle and the later ones lived outside the dominion of Rome. In fact Newton was excluded from admission to an appointment due to his disagreement with the Church of England over doctrine which he was not afraid to express. The only scientist who suffered for his faith was Giordano Bruno who held to the ideas of Copernicus. He also insisted on preaching heretical ideas in his position as a priest (eg denying the divinity of Christ) and as a priest refused to recant. He was not forced to hold orthodox Catholic doctrine (he could have left the priesthood) but was brought to task extremely harshly for teaching heresy as a priest. He was not killed for his scientific beliefs. Nor was he killed for holding his heretical religious beliefs but for teaching them.
Julio: Peter D, no. Wrong. Those scientists had to give glory to the god of the Pope or else they would not have the freedom to do their research.
Now, are you a Roman Catholic, yourself?
Peter D: Julio, as I said nearly all of them were outside the dominion of Rome, operating in Protestant Europe. You need to read a bit of history.
Descartes, who seeing the treatment of Galileo moved from Catholic France to Protestant Hol and and later Protestant Sweden for the greater freedom of thought. Yet he remained a Roman Catholic in Protestant lands where he was under no coercion to remain a Catholic or to become a Protestant. Doesn’t quite fit your (non-historical) theory does it?
Julio: Peter D, protestant fanaticism was similar to its Catholic counterpart.
Most freethinking men of those days - wel , prior to the Reformation, one should say - were afraid of the papacy tyranny. To be a scientist meant to be a Roman Catholic or fear the Pope. The oppression was reduced after the Reformation, but especial y after Napoleon invaded Rome and put an end to the “Holy Roman Empire”. Sadly, he didn’t destroy the Vatican and burn all that den of religious evil for a thousand years. He didn’t have the guts, sadly ... maybe he was eventual y defeated for missing his real 233
purpose in life.
Toxofilite T: Peter D, I didn’t discredit anything, you talking garbage.
Julio: Toxofilite T, it is very hard to attract people with a decent IQ to support religion.
Toxofilite T: Julio, thats the point, logic and reason is all you need to not believe in ancient myths.
Wayne G: Theism targets infants. But look how poorly you do when you face adults, you can’t even talk your way out of a paperbag.
Peter D: A belief in a God has always been a human trait. I have tried to find a reason for Nature making this Selection in our genetical y determined disposition for belief. We appear to be the only species to have acquired this. But if this is the case the existence or non existence of God is entirely irrelevant since Natural Selection (in its ‘wisdom’) has seen fit to ensure that the majority hold this belief (delusion or not). It is only
‘interested’ in survival of the fittest, possibly for some utilitarian purpose (in an otherwise purposeless existence) it has selected ‘faith’, perhaps to control our overactive brains from reaching the logical conclusion that there is no meaning. It might just be then that the fittest to survive are those of delusional faith which would enable the avoidance of the real conclusion of meaningless and thus despair and mass suicide.
David B: Peter D, “A belief in a God has always been a human trait”. Total y founded on primitive intellect... made sophisticated by the modern day pharisees. Still has that past use by date odour.
Del W: It is in the UK (where I’m from).
Michael C: As someone from the UK, we general y don’t have religion forced upon us and can make our own choice, as such I think atheism is 234
more popular, or at the very least on a similar level with religion.
Bob S: Indoctrination, brainwashing and how the human brain works.
Ron C: History since Ancient times is dominated by religion. Fire, thunder, clouds, good luck, bad luck. All these things that people don’t know, will believe a god is responsible for anything. Thousands of years of breeding and indoctrination keeps such stupidity alive. Those at the top realise it’s a cool way of controlling the gullible. Science and Education has pissed religion off as it loses control.
Tyler V: It is, in a significant portion of the world.
Darren R: A lot of people put the religion of their parents on surveys even if they identify as agnostic or atheist as it can cause problems with schools and other organizations.
Keith M: It is in much of Europe! (‘No religion’ is a majority view in, eg, UK, Scandinavia, Netherlands.. and significant majority amongst under 30s).
Graham P: Because people in large groups are stupid!
Jayfeather B: Truth be told, I think it’s because humans as a whole have the desire for something bigger than us, an easy explanation to what’s going on around us, someone who cares for us, and a longer life than is given. Religion can give hope to all of those and more good things.
David B: Yes... an easy explanation for everything.
Bil y K: Jayfeather B, but from dust thou come to dust thou shall return.
Raymond D: Maybe because pretending is more fun than facing reality; might be the best reason at al . After all that is what is required; the 235
doctrine of Theism vanity toward an afterlife requiring such pretenses.
Daniel R: Julio, isn’t it? You do know that it’s the third most common stance on belief, right? Just behind Christianity and Islam and ahead of Hinduism, Buddhism and every other religion.
Julio: Daniel R, atheism will grow in stature and quality, because millions upon millions of religious people are only nominal believers, never reading any holy book, praying to any god, or supporting any religion with their resources.
Erik S: Because of indoctrination in early years.
Ryan C: I think a lot of people want/need it to be true due to the fear of death, which happened a lot throughout history. It helps win wars believing a god has your back. I think the religious tend to have more kids, and kids tend to take on the beliefs of their parents, causing it to persist.
Ken W: It takes 2 things which only a certain percentage of humans possess: time to think, and a mind that can process logical y.
Molnár R: I always thought Atheism is more popular based on my own experiences. I know like 2 muslims, but nobody in my circle who is religious apart from my mum (and she says she doesn’t like religions but believes in God). I thought Atheism was super high in my country, but then I joined the group and realized we have such a low percentage. It was a surprise.
Martin P: Because people are stupid and uneducated.
Chris S: Because research shows that the majority of people in the world are stupid.
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Julio: Chris S, that’s a fair point.
Mathieu N: Because once a child is indoctrinated, he’ll stay this way in the majority of cases all his life. That’s also why you find nearly no Muslim in a Christian family and vice versa.
Tom A: Mathieu N, indoctrination goes way beyond the borders/
dimensions of religion.
Mathieu N: Tom A, oh I know. A child born in a socialist family tends to be more kind to poor people, while a child born in a conservative family tends to think more about themselves/their families first. All I did was answer the question that was asked.
Darwin P: For the same reason that most people are unable to think critically.
Eliza S: Because people like fiction.
Alvin N: Because people fear death.
Phil S: It’s tough to refrain from following fantasy.
Martial H: More people are emotional y unstable.
Don A: Why do people believe in god? I believe the biggest reason is fear.
It is to avoid the existential terror of living in an uncaring, unfeeling, non-sentient universe in which death is final, in which bad things can happen without warning to good people, in which good things can happen to bad people, in which there is no protection and very limited control over our fates. At any moment, things can go wrong: we can fall seriously il , be attacked and mugged, raped, or killed, hit by a train, etc. This feeling of helplessness is difficult to live with. Now religion, illogical though it may be, is careful y constructed to protect believers from this harsh reality. It 237
provides the concept of an afterlife to insulate us from the finality of death, and to reassure us that pains and problems of this life will be “made up for”
by some glorious fantasy future of eternity in heaven. It helps keep some people in line by threatening them with eternal torture in hel . It provides a theoretical y loving “Sky-Daddy” who can do miracles and magical y extricate us from trouble. Some people find great comfort in this belief.
Therefore, they are willing to overlook a lot. The self-contradictions in the Bible. The need for ‘faith,’ or in other words, the willingness to believe with neither scientific evidence nor proof. The embarrassing fact that, for example, the churches have a long history of repression and oppression of people. When they are total y immersed in the fantasy, they develop a strong dependency upon it. This is called religious faith. So it’s addictive, just like crack, heroin, or any other addictive drug. Moreover, people pass the addiction on to their children. They indoctrinate their children, to fortify their own religious delusions. The fact of the matter is, it takes courage to face the world unafraid. And many people just don’t have that courage.
Julio: very well explained, Don, thank you. You’re not even one percent wrong.
Eliza S: People love fairytale, that’s why.
Andrew D: Atheism is rising and religion is declining so give it a few decades, lol.
Kearsten I: Wel ... 1 billion Christians exist; 1 billion Muslims. Less of other religions. That’s roughly 1/8-1/9th of the human population.
Therefore atheism will always be bigger.
Jim G: Kearsten I, 2 billion Christians, 1 billion Muslims and the rest are not even close to being atheist. In fact atheism is slowly dying out global y due to lower birth rates and Christianity and Islam are exploding on a global scale. Atheists are only 7% of the population compared to 85% that 238
are religious.
Steve S: It is, unfortunately, because Society has not reached that type of level yet.
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33 – Tell us what you think about Al ah 52 comments
Julio: For those who don’t know: Al ah is an idol created in the Arabian Desert fifteen centuries ago. Muslims and other admirers tell us that Al ah is most merciful, but when I checked I discovered the opposite.
Hammad B: Julio, please share findings how you came to that conclusion.
Julio: Hammad B, you have to be intelligent.
Ahmad S: Julio, here is one of His mercy - S18:58 And your Lord is the Forgiving, full of mercy. If He were to impose blame upon them for what they earned, He would have hastened for them the punishment. Rather, for them is an appointment from which they will never find an escape.
Graham A: Al ah the perfect avatar as the representative of a god that is so concerned about sex and what people do in bed.
Glenn H: Unlikely to exist.
Jhun V: None of importance in history.
Dennis B: I don’t ever buy into fantasies.
Walter W: Al ah is the God concept invented by Muhammad and 43 of his companions that they created in various magic stories in a book they 239
wrote over a period of 23 years. Muhammad had seen how Constantine had used Christianity to unite and control the Jews and Christians, and he wanted to do the same to unite and control the squabbling Arab tribes of the time. It works rather well to train the Muslims that Al ah actual y existed. But a lot of the story characters and story ideas were copied from the previous religions of Judaism and Christianity. They made many changes to suit their own purposes like demoting Jesus to just be a Prophet. Unfortunately many of the tales the Quran writers used from the old Torah are now known to be fake stories that did not even happen.
Graham A: Walter W, they also incorporated narratives from the gnostic religions of the area.
Walter W: Graham A, yes; it is always easier to fool the locals with parts of myths they have already heard about, rather than invent whole new story characters and new plot lines out of thin air. Movie producers know that and make sequels that bring in more dol ars than the originals.
Steve L: Al an is a guy I used to play poker with and it turns out he is quite the racist. Although he draws the line at misogyny which still makes him better than Al ah.
Steven G: A fictional monster dreamed up by ancient barbarians.
Leonard C: There is insufficient evidence to support claims that Al ah exists.
Hammad B: Leonard C, the Quran is there and science which made many scientists and celebrities to think.
Julio: Hammad B, science has never endorsed the quran for anything scientific - only fanatical muslims come up with man-made stories to protect their book from critics. Surah 36:40 is clear evidence that no scientific facts exist in the quran. So, Al ah is only a man-made 240
anthropomorphic god, or better a miserable idol fabricated in the Arabian Desert of the 7th century. In that verse of surah 36 you see “Al ah” talking about a non-scientific geocentric universe, Earth its stationary center and Moon and Sun orbiting it. So, next time you post to protect a faulty holy book think twice, because not all around here are idiots.
Hammad B: Julio, this is a common, and deliberate, mistranslation of the Qur’an. We find these on anti-Islam sites quite often. What is actual y said is that the sun and the moon each move in their own orbits. No mention of an orbit around the Earth. Any astronomer can confirm that the sun orbits our galaxy. (36:40) Neither does it lie in the sun’s power to overtake the moon nor can the night outstrip the day. All glide along, each in its own orbit.
Julio: HB, you are a dishonest broker, the typical cynical position of Islamic scholars protecting a “holy book” created in the Dark Ages by illiterate muslims. Get lost, sir, you are not a trustworthy person. The verse does clearly represent a geocentric system, with th sun and moon gliding - do you understand this term? - gliding along both by each other. You are a bloody dishonest parrot, repeating slogans you heard in th mosque! I am going to block you for dishonesty, goodnight!
Mark B: 3rd-tier knockoff of a god that does not exist.
Ilona T: The Islamic version of the Abrahamic God, an invention of a primitive time of ignorance when people wondered where the sun goes at night, first invented to answer unsolved questions (why does it thunder, why do people get sick, why does everyone have to die, etc.). and then used by the powerful as a tool of control over the masses. As a tool of mass control, this Al ah, like the Christian version of this Abrahamic god, still works brilliantly, although we can answer many questions today without having to invent a god for it.
Bill T: Another version of totalitarianism and religious delusion. Aka 241
mind-forged manacle.
Dimitri K: Fal s to the same arguments as any Abrahamic notion of God.
Chris L: A religion that destroyed other religions that gathered at the Kabba, a black rock in Saudi Arabia.
John H: I general y don’t think about her. It means nothing to me whatsoever. The followers can be problematic.
Alvin N: Another fictional character amongst the over 3000 of them out there.
Bradleecross R: Who? You mean the same fictitious Abrahamic “god”
that the Jews, Christians and Muslims have been killing one another over for thousands of years? That “al ah”? Fake!
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34 – Ugly Quran: beat up a woman in bed, surah 4:34
107 comments
Julio: Quran endorsing domestic violence? “Those [women] whose nushuz you fear, admonish them, and abandon them in bed, and strike them.” The verse doesn’t specify what striking that is. What level of hitting their wives does it mean “strike them”? Divorce is not allowed to a woman, a victim of domestic violence. Islam is a religion of men, machos, and many muslims abuse their wives, one hears. When verses like this one were discovered in the ugly book, the so-called “scholars” arrived quickly to try to explain them to mean nothing like what they explicitly represent: violence. It is a massive exercise in religious hypocrisy and double standards, probably because those “scholars” do practise the commandment in the book themselves. You cannot trust a religion that was created in the deserts of the Middle East. I don’t. Now, an important 242
point to remember here: The lady the man is going to beat up in bed is the daughter of another muslim that agrees with the commandment! This other muslim will walk around the vil age or town playing pious and a peaceful muslim while his own daughter is being beaten up by another proud muslim. Yes, because in this setup the woman is the inferior vessel, and the husband married her not for love but for lust. And, by the way, can you tell me where exactly in the woman’s body is the husband hitting her, you tell me!
Syed T: Surat No. 4 Ayat No. 34 Men are protectors of women, because God has made some of them excel others and because they spend their wealth on them. So virtuous women are obedient and guard in the husband’s absence what God would have them guard. As for those from whom you apprehend infidelity, admonish them, then refuse to share their beds, and final y hit them [lightly]. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. For God is High, Great.” Give me any example when Mohamed abuses his wife?
Syed T: Molnár R, as i said Islam doesn’t encourage violence under any circumstances so you can have dialogue. Beating is not the 1st step you should take.
Julio: Syed T, but there are situations in islam where a man can beat up his wife, is that what you’re saying? You see, folks, in Islam violence against women is sanctioned if she resists a violent muslim. These unfortunate women are, in the end, daughters of other muslim men, who do not protect their daughters from other muslim men. It is a disgrace , a crime.
Syed T: Julio, I have already cleared this above, moreover you need to read and understand the full quran if you are an honest conversation starter.
If you are picking a verse out of context and without reading Mohamed ‘s biography you are biased and dishonest.
Julio: Syed T, where in the verse does it say what you twisted it to say? Why 243
would Al ah need you to correct that verse? Was Al ah not careful not to create the wrong impression leading to the wrong conclusion, and lead muslim men to beat their wives in bed?! Many turn out to be miserable fanatics sanctioning domestic violence against women in Islam. That verse is clear proof.
Youssef M: Julio, those are all false claims. I am a Muslim and none of my family members were beaten or they beat anyone. This is your ignorance not checking what context it means. Plus it’s never narrated that the prophet hit wives so how do you explain this? The quran was revealed to him and if this verse says do it, then him not doing it means not following the quran. So check the link I sent before for more context and understanding.
Julio: Youssef M, you don’t convince me. The order to hit a woman is in writing in your “holy book”, don’t be a hypocrite! I will block you for hypocrisy if you carry on denying your “holy book”, watch out! Many muslims must have hurt many women across the centuries of islamic rule. It clearly says hit the woman in bed! It is very ugly. Definitely a dangerous cult from the Dark Ages, and should be declared so by the UN, my opinion on the matter. And what do you mean by “punished”, what do you mean, Youssef?! The quran does state that the husband can beat and hit and spank a woman. Period. Now, the “scholars” come up with fantastic explanations that islam is a religion that protects women! I trust no islamic scholars, never. Charlatans disguised as pious characters.
Then you send me a video of one of those dishonest “scholars” offering a completely twisted explanation trying to reinterpret the term “hit” [your wife in bed]. Get lost, hypocrite. You are one of those muslims I would never invite over for tea and biscuits in my rose garden! I don’t need hypocrites in my life!
Gabby L: Youssef M, are you saying that what Muhammad did or didn’t do is how you live your life? He never commented on Facebook. Does that mean you shouldn’t comment on Facebook?
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Julio: “Julio this is total y wrong and you are punished for it.” Explain what you mean by this sentence.
Youssef M: Julio I am saying your sentence is wrong that men can force women for sexual things. And if they do so they are punished. Sorry if it seemed you are punished. I mean if men do so they are punished, I explained it in the comment above anyway.
Ahmad S: Julio, there is prohibition of violent treatment for the wife in the Quran. S4:19 O you who have believed, it is not lawful for you to inherit women by compulsion. And do not make difficulties for them in order to take [back] part of what you gave them unless they commit a clear immorality. And live with them in kindness. For if you dislike them perhaps you dislike a thing and Al ah makes therein much good.
S2:231 And when you divorce women and they have [nearly] fulfilled their term, either retain them according to acceptable terms or release them according to acceptable terms, and do not keep them, intending harm, to transgress [against them]. And whoever does that has certainly wronged himself. And do not take the verses of Al ah in jest. In addition, it can be said that no other scripture in the world except the Quran give the women similar right against the men. S2:228, And women shall have rights similar to the rights against them, according to what is equitable; but men have a degree over them. And Al ah is Exalted in Power, Wise.
Woman’s right is therefore the same as that of the man if the man has the right to beat the woman so is vice versa. However, the last option to beat is not to hurt but to beat as a signal for divorce. S4:34 , As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Al ah is Most High, great above you al . Based on S2:228, the wives therefore have the same rights against their disloyal husband to admonish the husband, refused to share their bed, and last option in the above as a last resort is to signal for divorce by beating. Both have the right to do 245
the beating as an action to proceed for divorce but here is the permissible way to beat approved by God in the Quran as in the example by Job, S38:44, We told him, “Take a handful of straw. Beat with it to fulfill your oath.” We found him to be patient. What an excellent servant he was.
He was certainly most repenting. The example is given, so beat with the straw either the wife or husband a last resort as a signal to proceed for divorce in the approved way as is stated in the Quran. The application of the verses of the Quran is consistent with no physical violence If all other options are exhausted the ritual can be initiated by either party. S4:128 If a wife fears cruelty or desertion on her husband’s part, there is no blame on them if they arrange an amicable settlement between themselves; and such settlement is best.
I’dris E: Crazy shit.
Julio: I’dris E, ugly religion from the Dark Ages! Should be condemned by the UN as pernicious and an enemy of justice and a violation of women’s rights. No man has any right to hit any woman - it is a crime the quran sanctions, bloody hell of a holy book! Check surah 24:2 and see how bloody violent Islam is. These “scholars” are cynical y dishonest in their exegesis; I trust none of them.
I’dris E: Julio, Islam is evil and should be seriously condemned.
Julio: I’dris E, yes, it is wicked, evil and satanic. It is condemned by any moral person. Only immoral people admit that it is religious to hit and beat up a woman in bed because some Al ah from the Arabian Desert said so in a “holy book”! Islam is materialised evil, and it is already condemned for that by normal, moral people. Nobody needs any islam or quran to be decent human beings. In fact, the contrary is what happens: the more religious the less moral.
Peter N: Ugly quran: the city council in a Pakistani vil age convicted a woman to death by stoning because her husband was cheating on her.
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Julio: Peter N, ugly religion from the Dark Ages! Should be condemned by the UN as pernicious and an enemy of justice and a violation of women’s rights. No man has any right to hit any woman - it is a crime the quran sanctions, bloody hell of a holy book!
Julio: Then Youssef M sends me another video with another explanation for the wife beating verse, which he says is right in the context. Bul shit; I do not trust any book of any God that needs “scholars” to interpret it for me! Where in the quran does it say that I must go and find a scholar to explain it for me? I did read it three times in great distress for all its violence. Did you never notice the violent part of your holy book, real y?
Or have you never read it yourself?
Youssef M: Julio, not mine, I am not claiming to know things. And I said go check authentic sources. But I am saying this verse you are saying it says hit the women is not what you are saying it is. You wanna know what it says listen to this, here’s the link.
Vinnie B: Youssef M, sounds like you’re making Julio’s point for him. Let me ask you this. Do you think that the millions upon millions of Muslims from non-Arabic speaking countries who must rely on one of the 100 or so translations of the Qur’an are true Muslims? Because I’ve heard that only people who read it in the original Qur’anic Arabic are considered to be true Muslims. And if not, what does that mean for the number of Muslims out there, and the claim that Islam is the world’s fastest growing religion? Surely if the millions of people in India, for example, who claim to be Muslims, can’t be considered true Muslims, then the number of actual Muslims would be relatively low, right?
Julio: Youssef M, you are playing stupid here, and that is very bad! Why should I need to read it in old Arabic to see that the quran determines that you can beat up a woman in bed?! Would it make any difference if I read it in the original old Arabic? It wouldn’t, don’t be a hypocrite.
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Youssef M: Vinnie B, I didn’t say that. There is nothing called true muslims or not true muslims; we are equal, and they are even better than me. And information for you is that non-native Arabic-speaking muslims are much more than native Arabic-muslims, which is a great thing and real y I love it. But all scholars that would want to ful y understand quran have to learn Arabic to ful y understand it. Because quran is revealed in Arabic and even the translation many times is hard to 100% mean what it is. My point was he is saying he read it 3 times and he decided that this means that. All I am saying is you need to study and have degrees in islam and even be able to know exactly Arabic and graduate from islamic university to claim what each sentence does. Which I am not claiming I do. But the guy in the link below is a scholar and a student of knowledge. Why don’t you hear what he is saying and seek knowledge from comments?
Janis A: Youssef M, if you believe that the best an omnipotent god could come up with is the quran, then you are an idiot.
Garry T: Youssef M, in what context is it ok to beat a woman?
Julio: Garry T, perfectly answered, well done. These poor souls live by a big lie: their violent religion. There are other parts in the quran where extreme violence is applied to women, one case is suarh 24:2. Surah 5:33 is one very well known. Verse 32 is what muslims always quote, but they never never never quote the next verse, 33. Go check. Islam is essential y a bloody dangerous cult of extremists and men with the desire to overpower others for their private gain. No Al ah ever wrote any holy book, nor ordered any man to speak for him. Islam is a cult of men playing pious to overpower other men, even with extreme violence. Women have suffered intensely under this cult from the Dark Ages, and still suffer today. There are countries where women have less rights than men, and only considered walking vaginas, as somebody once said. Yet, no man needs religion to be a decent human being. Prove me wrong and win $20
for the Salvation Army! You see, folks, in Islam, violence against women 248
is sanctioned if she resists a violent muslim. These unfortunate women are, in the end, daughters of other muslim men, who do not protect their daughters from other muslim men, a vicious circle of disrespect for women. Domestic violence is sanctioned by the quran, bottom line. It is a disgrace , a crime. And here comes this muslim playing pious and telling me to go and read the original quran to understand why “Al ah”
instructed about beating wives in bed! It is a rotten corpse of a cult from the Dark Ages!
Lawrence W: Julio, no wonder Islam is so widely despised.
Eliza S: That is the mentality of religion.
Julio: Syed, where in the verse does it say what you twisted it to say? Why would Al ah need you to correct that verse? Was Al ah not careful not to create the wrong impression leading to the wrong conclusion, and lead muslim men to beat their wives in bed?! Many turn out to be miserable fanatics sanctioning domestic violence against women in Islam. That verse is clear proof. The bloody verse does clearly say beat up a wife in bed! Now, here you come with your private interpretation trying to correct Al ah with a twisted context! Man, you are a miserable hypocrite!
That’s actual y the interpretation of some “scholars”, because in your cult you fear to put out your own opinion about anything in the “holy book”
in fear of persecution or being called an apostate, the worst situation for any practicing muslim. You do not fool me. That’s what a cruel religion does to women. Sanctioning the beating up of a woman is deeply evil, and only Islam sanctions such a crime - see surah 24:2! It is a crime against women! Islam should be declared a crime against humanity, not a religion of peace and tolerance.
Martin B: Wel , the ugly Bible says offer up your daughters for rape.
Tom A: Ugly State Atheism, “The Chinese Communist Party is waging a targeted campaign against Uyghur women, men, and children, and 249
members of other Turkic Muslim minority groups in Xinjiang, China.
Documented human rights abuses include coercive population control methods, forced labor, arbitrary detention in internment camps, torture, physical and sexual abuse, mass surveil ance, family separation, and repression of cultural and religious expression.”
Julio: That could be propaganda, you know. The story I heard is that islam is trying to infiltrate China, and China reacted against it. No Chinese need islam. So, it is natural to oppose it. The Chinese authorities don’t want the Chinese people to be told to believe in flying horses of the 7th century.
Youssef M: Julio, how funny it is in one post you are against violence, but when it comes to violence against islam you say it is natural. A real hypocrite.
Julio: Youssef M, you are the one, not me. You protect a cult that oppresses women. Nobody needs islam to be decent human beings. In my eyes, you lost all your humanity. I shall never invite you over for tea and Kuwait dates in my rose garden, so much I depreciate religious fanaticism. A fact is that any place islam goes, there goes a retrograde cult from the 7th century, with flying horses. No Chinese want to be a religious retard.
Tom A: Julio, so what laws do you abide by that Muslims abide by in their Islam? Or should I just ask what laws do you borrow from religion to be your own? After al , you will have to.
Hammad B: Haha wtf man are you for real? The meaning of beating the wife in bed is to separate yourselves through divorce agreement.
Julio: Hey, Hammad, where in the verse or context does it say such a thing? You are a dishonest interpreter. We all know how so-called scholars operate to reinterpret crude and violent verses to make them appear like they are nice. You, in other words, rephrase the verses and correct what 250
Al ah original y inspired, as it were. Your religion is a rotten egg in my opinion.
Lawrence W: That bul shit story actual y tel s you to “strike and admonish”
“disobedient” women. How detestable a criminal cult!
Mida A: Lawrence W, you can read the verse and all context to understand the real meaning.
Lawrence W: Mida A, no ‘context’ will justify beating women; it’s islam’s barbarity, criminal; today, it is a crime in many countries.
Ron C: It shows what kind of sub humans they are.
Stephen S: Islam is a terrible religion and Christianity runs a very close second!
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35 – Islam: where women are inferior human beings 65 comments
Julio: Under the rules of this primitive cult of darkness, the husband can beat up his wives - surah 4:34. There is no punishment for the husband’s misconduct if caught in extra-marital affairs. It is important to expose Islam for what it is: a bloody dangerous cult of men playing pious, instructed by delusional characters from the Dark Ages. Thank the Internet for helping to discover the evil roots of Islam. The West must wake up and fight back this cult from the Dark Ages trying to infiltrate democracies to return them to retrograde moralities of the 7th century.
Vinnie B: Julio, bold of you to claim Islam considers women to be human beings...
Julio: Vinnie B, I understand. Sadly, in this brutal cult from the Dark 251
Ages no woman has any freedom to stand up in the Market Square to complain about how Islam treats them. We have the obligation to expose this horrendous cult for the oppression of women across lands where this monster rules.
Vinnie B: Julio, I agree.
Julio: It’s an evil cult from the Dark Ages I don’t award any dignity.
Youssef M: Total y false claims.
Wef D: Youssef M, do women have equal rights in islamic societies?
Youssef M: Wef D, define islamic societies. I am not here to defend societies and if one country is acting wrong this doesn’t reflect the religion. But if you are asking about women rights in islam? They have equal rights as men. And in many places even more; check what islam says about the mother and her rights. Here’s a very simple example to see how much wrong you are about islam: if your aunt is not married for any kind of reason, as a man your father should take care of his sister and help her.
And even as the person himself he should help and provide money for his aunt and it’s a duty on him. If people don’t do it or they do something total y opposite this doesn’t mean islam is wrong; this means people are wrong. Many muslims unfortunately don’t understand their religion wel , and they try to use it for their own benefit.
Julio: You don’t need a religion from the Dark Ages to be moral and a decent human being. Islam is a source of much immorality against women. Check surah 24:2, and “Al ah” using the words “without mercy”
when he ordered the lashing of a pregnant damsel. And don’t tell me she was not pregnant, because how would the leaders find out if nobody knew about the affair? No mercy, from the “most merciful”, go check it yourself and don’t come back with “scholars” explaining what is very clear! As I said, a very violent and evil religion of brutality by men in a society where 252
women had no voice. A man could marry many women, but the woman could not even choose the man she loved. Evil religion, seeing from a modern morality model.
Wef D: Youssef M, can a woman marry 3 men? Simple answer, yes or no.
Youssef M: Wef D, no, Those kind of rights you are asking for? Simply as this: men are created differently than women and there are things given for women not given to men and the other way around.
Wef D: Youssef M, can a man marry 3 women? Again yes or no answer, please.
Youssef M: Yes he can. Let me give you another information: should a man take care of his wife and provide everything for her and give her his money? Yes, it’s a must in islam. The other question is, should a woman if she’s working to provide money to the husband or contribute in house expenses? No, it’s not a must and she can decide whatever she wants to do with her money, and the man should not even ask her about her money.
But for the man it’s obligatory to take care and pay her allowance. So I don’t see this as equal, based on your criteria. That’s why 1 question or 1
topic doesn’t judge all religions.
Julio: Youssef M, where exactly is this practised? In Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Libya, Palestine? Chickened out and ran away to avoid telling us where in the islamic world are those stories respected. These propagandists want to apply Taqiyya, Tawriya codes to deceive us, but we know better. Check on the Internet what these four terms mean: Taqiyya, Tawriya, Kitman, Muruna, and how Islam lies to its victims.
Gabby L: Youssef M, where in the Quran is this information about the father giving his sister money and taking care of her?
Youssef M: Gabby L, there is information about islam from the hadeeth 253
“the prophet teaching” as wel , combined together.
Youssef M: Julio, I suggest you real y go educate yourself a little better than this hatred posts you always have.
Julio: Hatred post? Isn’t Islam a religion full of hatred? There is hatred amongst themselves to the point of wars and perpetual conflicts for minor differences in the story. Also, Islam is very violent and full of hatred against those opposing it, to the point of dispatching them to eternal Jahannam or hel . That is the ultimate hatred in “a religion of peace & tolerance”. So, you need better education about Islam.
Youssef M: Don’t take information about islam from non-islamic sources and websites, because they don’t truly represent islam.
Garry T: Youssef M, is the Quran non-Islamic?
Julio: Youssef M, I did read the quran. That’s where all the violent tirades are in writing. The book starts with a big lie right away: “Al ah the most merciful!” By verse 7 you see Al ah metamorphosing into a cruel, intolerant, vengeful, irate, and wrathful tyrant threatening those who question his “mercy”! And he is Insecure and Imperfect doing favours to those who call him great! All that in verse 7 of the first surah Al-Fatihah.
A few verses up, surah 2:24 here comes Al ah again with more threats and much worse violence. It never stops to the last page. I did read the bloody violent book. It is a “holy” book covered in violence, to push a monster created in the Arabian Desert in the 7th century CE. You don’t need Islam for you to be a decent person; on the contrary: religion turns a decent person into a cruel beast, coming the chance. Islam divides wherever it goes, because it represents an imperfect, cruel, inexistent God.
Garry T: Youssef M, it’s 2022, and we all know about the hateful ideology that Islam now is. Your Takkiya won’t work anymore. Islam has a violent history; undeniable.
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Julio: Garry T, Youssef is getting on my nerves with his religious misdemeanours, he real y is! He’s running the risk of being blocked out from here.
Garry T: Julio they are worse than Christian’s tying themselves in knots, lying about their hateful violent ideology.
Julio: They go by instructions called Taqiyya, Tawriya, Kitman, Muruna, where deception to protect Islam is required. I’ve debated these terms with them many times before, and know exactly how they react by calling up “scholars” to explain the terms, as if we were stupid students.
Wef D: Youssef M, “And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men (available), then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them (two women) errs, the other can remind her.” Is the value of a woman witness equal to the value of a man?
Youssef M: Julio, funny, always like this, threatening and you don’t like someone to show the truth just want to share your fake misleading information.
Julio: ... and muslims do admire a barbaric Al ah like that! Man, Islam is horror impossible to describe.
Sunshine B: Youssef M, the question Wef D asked was, “What advancements in society have been brought by Islamic scholars in the past 800 years?” That would be the 13th century. Why are you responding with a scholar from the 9th century?
Wef D: Is it possible to have equality in a society that doesn’t allow one gender the same rights that it allows another gender?
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Eliza S: Atheism: where nobody is inferior.
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36 – Was Jesus suicidal? Matthew 20:18
68 comments
Julio: Yes, sadly. “Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him: and the third day he shall rise again.”
Jesus had some serious mental problem, sadly. Of course the intelligent student can read between the lines of this drama. This story was written after the events. It is what the intelligent student cal s cheating the reader to build an untrue story. Jesus was going to Jerusalem knowing that the Romans would crucify him?! Stupid, if you ask me!
Ola L: Julio, was Jesus violent? Matthew 10:34 Jesus said: Don’t think I come with peace, but with a sword!
Julio: Ola Liljegren Yes and no. Yes, if that passage is true – I know it very wel , having debated it for 30 years with many adversaries. No, if that passage is just fiction by Matthew, who was a big liar, according to Luke.
Ola L: Julio, I know, but I think it’s somewhat ironic in the context of what believers say about Jesus.
Julio: Ola L, yes, Christians are so brainwashed by their leaders that they fail to see the most obvious, that the gospel is a man-made story, the proof its violent side. I constantly warn them to discredit this violent gospel, because it is impossible that what they label an Almighty God would not have a peaceful means to save whoever he wanted to save. What ful y discredits this gospel of a crucified Christ is its bloody violence. And next, the same brainwashed Christians take the side of violence to threaten 256
those who want to help them. Very disturbed people.
Dave J: How can a god die for everyone’s sins? If Jesus is a monotheistic god that is all mighty and all powerful, who created the entire universe and everything within it, then has the capability to insert himself into a teenage mother, only to be born as a miracle. Thirty-three years later he has the ultimate power to temporarily die, so he can come back and claim it was for everyone’s sins. What a way to pull the blanket over theists eyes!
Good job Jesus, a fictional character.
Julio: Dave J, yes. The story is full of holes. It is a Super God that is dead for 36 hours to save a few Jews, nothing else. The problem is about many dishonest merchants doing business with this “Super God” dead for 36
hours. Most dishonest retailers.
Dennis E: Dave J, do your research. Jesus is recorded in many histories.
“Julius Africanus quotes the historian Thal us in a discussion of the darkness that followed the crucifixion of Christ (Extant Writings, 18)”. So you’re going to ignore the proof I just gave. Classic.
Dave J: Dennis E, that’s not proof.
Dennis E: Dave J, ok let’s then ignore history. See how far that gets us.
Dave J: Dennis E, that’s not history is it, just written claims. The same as Robin Hood, Robin of Loxley who was a character that stole from the rich and gave to the poor. There are many references of him written in books, location of his pinions where he grew up and many references to who ran England at the time and no historical evidence of him existing just like Jesus. If you refer to historical evidence by books, Scriptures and many other stories from other sources, then what about all the Greek, Egyptian, Incas historian Scriptures and stories of their religions and gods?
Julio: Later, Christians created the story that Jesus died and was dead for 257
three day. Liars. The story says that Jesus died on Good Friday at around 3 PM, and returned from the dead at 3 AM on Easter Sunday - only dead for 36 hours. It’s a lie, obviously. Three days of 12 hours each, go jump in the lake.
Ross E: Julio, I hold scripture in very low regard.
Julio: You see, folks, this story of a Christ being crucified to save the Jews can only be false, utterly false. The Jews rejected it. Later, it was re-choreographed to turn this Jewish Christ into a universal Saviour. All was done for business. Why do I say this? Because it is simply impossible that some Super Almighty God out there wanting to save the Jews or the world, would have chosen the violent plan when there was a better one, a plan without violence. That’s basic, folks. If there was the need to save the Jews or the world, why would what is defined as a Super Almighty God need to implement a bloody violent plan? It is a very sinister story.
Jesus was suicidal, first of al , and secondly he was no Saviour of anybody.
The entire scene of him being martyred for the Jews is baloney! Now, the dishonest merchants pushing and selling Jesus as the Saviour do it for their own dishonest nature. They are merchandising a suicidal Christ that saved nobody in 2000 years of religious commerce with his suicide. That’s it. You learned something important today - for free. Good night.
Mark S: Julio, Christianity was all Jewish at the beginning before doing the work Jesus commanded.
Julio: Mark S, if you study textual criticism, you will understand that Jesus didn’t command anything. His oral stories were - much later, after he disappeared from circulation - were not commandments. The New Testament is a hoax, a false document, a fabrication, a counterfeit product, a forgery. Nothing in there is genuine content.
Mark S: Julio nothing you just said is more than conspiracy and not even worth commenting about. Suicide is killing yourself. He was killed by the 258
authorities/rulers.
Hope L: Mark S, nope. He said he laid his life down and that no man could take it unless he let them. Checkmate. If you know the train is coming and start walking down the track in its direction, did the train hit you or did you hit the train?
Mark S: Hope L, you seem confused about actual suicide and sacrifice.
Do you say the soldier throwing himself on a grenade committed suicide or sacrificed himself?
Hope L: Mark S, aren’t we just playing semantics now?
Mark S: Hope L, if you can’t answer you would say that.
Hope L: Whatever makes you feel right.
Rob C: It doesn’t matter, Jesus was the result of people discovering mushrooms.
Andile L: Jesus was literal y foretelling his death (the third time). Has absolutely nothing to do with suicide, what are you even saying.
Robin W: Why would he be if he was that well hung?
Ronald W: If he died on purpose yes that would be suicide.
Paul N: Another dumb post, please are you speaking from the psychiatric hospital,then do well and take your pil s.
Julio: No ad hominem comments tolerated. Attack the topic, not the author. One more and you will be blocked.
Paul N: Julio you are attacking Jesus, is he not also a being?
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Julio: Paul N, I did not attack you. And also did not attack Jesus. I asked a question. Anything wrong with asking questions about Jesus? I am an intelligent student that studied the gospel for many years. Maybe you didn’t.
Paul N: Julio, when you make ignorant claims about him being suicidal as a “ former intelligent Bible student “ then it is two things either you did not even study the Bible well or you just feel like mocking.
Julio:P Paul N, you are overstepping your privileges around here, and misfiring badly to protect Jesus. Don’t do that. You are not responsible for Jesus’ problems. Relax, and enjoy the discussion, or you will be blocked.
Last warning.
Paul N: Julio, he got no problems my brother, it is you who needs to dig deeper. Christianity is deeper than you think; that’s why some people spend years at the seminary to understand the grasp of it.
Julio: Paul N, Christianity is deep in lies. I did my deep studies; that’s why I ended up rejecting it. I checked the product on sale and found it to be a forgery, counterfeit. Simple as that. It is not you that is going to tell me anything about it. Also, I find it preposterous that you anointed yourself as a protector of Jesus. You are not. You are a victim of religious lies, sadly.
Ron C: He was just a pile of stories written about hearsay. King Arthur, Robin Hood and others, all have become real to their believers. Not a single eyewitness of him, let alone what he said to nobody.
Peter D: Ron C, history (as much as it can be believed about any person from its sources) records many eye witnesses. Most historians do not dispute the historicity of Jesus. You need to do some research before making claims about how you would prefer things to have been.
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Ron C: Peter D, I did not dispute the fact that there may be a person of some relevance like King Arthur or Robin Hood. But you need to grasp the fact that eye witness statements are good history. Hearsay is real y not.
Some historians actual y do dispute, so maybe you should do research.
I have watched Jesus in my research. I wasted 30 years on that book.
Wanting him to exist is real nice, but he is the writings of 4 Pseudonyms who wrote in Greek. The alleged Jesus would have spoken Aramaic. Do your research. In the entire first Christian century Jesus is not mentioned by a single Greek or Roman historian, religion scholar, politician, philosopher or poet. His name never occurs in a single inscription, and it is never found in a single piece of private correspondence. Zero! Zip references!” Bart Ehrman, Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill said that.
Peter D: Ron C, I make very certain to do thorough research before making any comments and load them thus keeping personal opinion to the very minimum. Even the very much biased and partisan anonymously-protected authors of Wikipedia concede “virtual y all scholars of antiquity accept that Jesus was a historical figure”. In Queensland on the Atherton Tableland there are some small volcanic lakes formed from vulcanism ten to twelve thousand years ago. A botanist recording the names of rainforest plants in the local language from one of its last speakers was surprised by his informant’s stressing what he considered an extra and important detail. At the time of the lakes’ formation he said the rainforest was absent and it was the dryer eucalypt forest that grew there. This was later shown to be absolutely correct from pollen samples in the lakes’ sediment. An eye witness account passed down oral y for at least 10 millennia! Here we are talking about written eye witness accounts only 2 millenia old. Be careful with your skepticism.
Julio: The problem with Christs is that they wanted to help the Jews with acts of violence. Their plan could not be from a divine source. A divine source would have foreseen the situation when it was still minor and small in size. A proper, senior, mature, experienced Almighty would 261
fix the problem when the problem was small and easy to fix. This means that the gospel is a human story, not divinely inspired. Where there is violence there is no divine inspiration. Bottom line for this terrible story of a suicidal Christ: nobody needed to be crucified to save anybody. The so-called “Gospel-of-Jesus-Christ” is not from a divine origin.
Ashley T: Yep, he was a liar, too.
Peter D: Just how many red herrings have you got up your sleeve? These sil y types of questions have no bearing on the problem of whether there is a God and an afterlife and therefore possibly the need to do something about it, or “nothing but blind, pitiless indifference” and therefore no point even discussing it. Unfortunately on this post group they are all too frequent from both sides of the fence.
Johannes T: If there was someone who used to fear death, he was Jesus; he also said he wished Judas had not been born.
Martial H: Certainly masochistic!
Gary B: Yes, Jesus struggled with drug addiction for years before he became a savior casting him down into deep depression.
Andrew H: Who cares.
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37 – Jesus predicted the rising of Atheism across the world [1]
100 comments
Julio: Luke 18:8b – “Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shal he find faith on the earth?” You can replace the world “predicted” with
“feared”. Jesus feared the rising of Atheism in the last days. He didn’t know how to fix the situation 2000 years earlier. Incompetent. Would be easier if he played it cool, not with violence. Unfortunately, Jesus was a dangerous 262
militant with an extremely violent manifesto that backfired on him and his admirers. The manifesto was to violently remove the Romans from Palestine and install what he called the “Kingdom of God”, an extremely bloody and violent monarchy in the lines of his ancestor King David, who had a war machine of over a million and a half conscripts [1 Chr 21], bigger that the American one, if you believe the ridiculous story. Jesus wanted that back in Palestine. Luckily, he was betrayed, and the Romans lynched him. Much later, the bishops of Rome elevated him to a son of God, and the rest is history, a history of violence, division, and perpetual bad fruit by his admirers across the world.
Robin D: And other fairy tales.
Begen J: Jesus ain’t real. Jesus was a gay pedo terrorist in the Christian fairytale.
Spare V: it’s not real y much of a prediction to suggest that some people might not believe the total y bul shit story you made up.
Jenny S: Yet they think it’s some sort of god-given prophecy that nobody else could’ve figured.
Julio: Spare V, when Jesus told his admirers “I doubt it if there will be faith in me in the last days” he was worried that his arrival had been a flop. For that, and to save face, he promised to return soon. Liar. It is certain that he never returned, and will never. You see, the dynamics of this story that Jesus will return was only to save face, nothing else. He messed up the Romans, and they lynched him, end of story. Faith in Jesus is dwindling across the world. He knew it twenty centuries ago. What was the reason for his worry? I can tell you.
Spare V: Julio, Jesus is a fictional character.
Julio: Spare V, a dangerous fictional character, at that. His admirers and 263
followers produced a yielding of bad fruit for the last twenty centuries.
Navin O: Well we are obeying God, if he outlined that to happen.
Jenny S: Alright, so your god clearly wants us to be atheists. Right?
Julio: Jenny S, their God; I detest Gods. Why do I detest Gods? I can tel you why.
Jenny S: Julio, your god clearly wants us to be atheists, right?
Rich H: Atheists have existed since way before Jesus’ time.
Julio: Rich H, true. Did you know that the original gospel of Matthew ended at verse 17, chapter 28? You didn’t know? Wel , there you see the first atheists he created.
Bo A: So he did say something right?
Garry T: How do you know that’s what Jesus said?
Dave J: Atheists existed millions of years before any religions were created.
Julio: Millions?! Then probably before the dinosaurs...?
Ivan W: Fortunately for Atheists, the asshole god does not exist.
Katherine R: Imagine believing that a god saying that people will eventual y think he’s fake is actual y evidence of him being real.
Walter W: Atheism predated Jesus. And Jesus did not write those words in the book of Luke. We know now in the 21st century that all those writings were fabricated into “the Gospels” in the 2nd century by the early Church Fathers, and were actual y by unknown authors. There is nothing 264
written by Jesus in his whole life, just as there is not one single account by anybody written during Jesus’ whole life that even mentions his name once. Whatever the man Jesus real y said or did we shall never know because he failed miserably to get noticed enough to have anyone think to jot down a few words about him. You are told by Christianity in its Creed that you must just submit to take those later Gospel stories on faith. So be content with that, just like the Hindus and Muslims also must blindly believe illogical magic stories men wrote in their books. When you figure out why it is that none of the magic Creator Gods had the power to write, or make their own books, or even have the power to speak for themselves, then you will be on the road to truth.
Simon A: Lol, very funny. But you are right insomuch that non-belief in the “my god exists” claim is rising across the world.
Raymond D: Jesus predicted nothing as he never existed. John of Patmos was a racing ranting, rambling lunatic as schizophrenic.
Jim L: The Bible is a comic book.
Julio ... rather a bloody dangerous weapon of division and bad fruit.
Dan P: You mean if I made something up and predicted some people wouldn’t believe that bul shit I’m a prophet?
Julio: Dan P, yes and no.
Dan P: Julio, I am a God, and I predict that if I start a church with me as the God, the government will come after me for tax evasion, if I claim the money I received is tax deducted. By your logic I’m a prophet?
Will H: Yeah, because he knew religion was all smoke and mirrors and people would figure it out. He certainly was a man ahead of his time.
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Frank C: There were already atheists long before that shit showed up on the scene.
Yoshi S: You are not helping Christian apologists with that statement.
Julio: I know, but somebody must tell them that pushing lies about Jesus should not be their activity in life. I did read several of the Christian apologists of the past, and some of the present, and can conclude that most if not all indulged in comments that tried to elevate a divisive force called gospel to the eights of divine inspiration. It is a deceptive activity.
Yoshi S: Julio, it’s their nature.
Julio: There are two serious imponderables in this position of Jesus: [1]
Predicting the improvement of society through Atheism, why didn’t he become an atheist? [2] If what he taught would not improve the living conditions of humankind, why wasting his time pushing a defective gospel? Try to answer these questions if you consider yourself an intelligent student [I know the answers, obviously].
Immanuel C: Julio, do you want to know why people become atheists?
Let us look at our own faces. Our hypocrite faces. Read Romans 2:24. We hurt people by our improper evangelism. We become so nonsensical. We become against truth and science. We just built a huge bubble around ourselves in the name of God and “think” we will be saved. We have gone far far rather than the way of serving others and loving others. We abused the name of the Lord (3rd commandment) so much that people become against Him. Let us start with ourselves.
Julio: Immanuel, speak for yourself; I’m not in that trade, you are.
Phil S: It’s like someone who predicts “a big earthquake” 2000 years into the future.
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Brent T: Rise of common sense you mean?
Julio: Jesus suffered from excessive narcissism due to a hormonal dysfunction, which led him to think he was the son of God, and an element of the Trinity. It was probably the worst case in the history of mankind.
Brent T: Julio, I believe so, too. Many fell for it, too. Lol Julio: Brent T, his hormonal dysfunction became a massive industry of dishonesty. Popes were particularly vicious with the commerce they did selling rosaries, indulgences, crucifixes, and saying masses. They charged for everything, including funerals, the bloody crooks.
Brent T: Julio, oh damn. For sure. Good point.
Julio: Essential y, it was them, the popes, who contributed to the rising of atheism everywhere. You remember that Jesus called Pope Peter the First, Satan. The first pope was a thief and a liar, and Jesus still gave him the keys to open and close anything he wished.
Mathieu N: So even he knew that his bul shit would not convince anyone?
Alvin N: Jesus never existed, so this is another lie.
James L: lies.
Skylar L: Make a claim then say there will be some who don’t believe.
Woooow. So impressive!
Julio: Skylar L, who made a claim: Jesus? Not only one, he made many.
Skylar L: Julio, who made a claim: Krishna? Not only one, he made many.
Ian P: Jesus never existed.
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Hope L: What does Jesus win for being right?
Julio: Nothing. He is now a bone fossil somewhere in Palestine.
Hope L: Julio, wrong; in the Book of Thomas he said to look under a rock if you wanna find him. Jesus is a scorpion.
Julio: Hope L, LOL, right, I had forgotten that important scripture!
Andrew G: So you are saying even he knew he was bul shit?
Steve F: How could someone who never existed predict anything?
Ron Calvert: Jesus never wrote a damn word, just hearsay by more hearsay.
Not an eye witness for him. He seemed to be a shit carpenter too.
Cheryl A: Theists are so gullible and desperate. They will believe anything that will support what they want to be true.
Martial H: Jesus cuts my lawn on Saturdays.
Eliza S: No, Julio, he didn’t, he was a character in a made-up book, or series of books.
Chris D: Jesus is a deification of the mushroom Amanita muscaria and the “truth” it brings you. You, like Moses, eat the mushrooms and become
“god”. All “religions” came from mushrooms.
Julio: I said that in another discussion, haha.
John J: Duh?! Doesn’t take a deity to figure out that some wouldn’t believe that bul shit!
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Benjamin C: Lol
Peter C: Benjamin, you are going to have to explain that to him.
Julio: Explain what, that Jesus predicted the end of his religion?
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38 – Prove that Jesus was the Saviour and win $20!
30 comments
Julio: One thing is to say Jesus is the Saviour of the World, and another to prove it. Be careful with your proof, because we have at least 20 centuries of empirical data to prove the opposite. Don’t play the fool here among the intelligent students, I warn. These twenty bucks are not easy to win or easy money, don’t fool yourself. It is the same as I posted the other day:
“Prove that Muhammad was a prophet and win $20!” Nobody succeeded in proving the guy was a prophet. So, take your time to prove that Jesus was the Saviour, or better give up right away to avoid embarrassment.
Durga E: Here is a picture of the Pope on a wheelchair: clear proof that there is no Saviour, and that prayer does not work, and there is no God to heal anybody or save anybody from anything.
Julio: Durga E, good il ustration, but that is a scene of a circus called RCC!
The RCC is a scam organisation pretending to represent a God it cal s Almighty. The Pope says he represents an Almighty God! There you have a dishonest character living a parasitic life at the expense of all those victims that give him money to keep the fraud and scam going for centuries, such a den of crooks!
Brian T: Back to this scam, eh? So sad that people need to resort to rat-like behavior in order to get their attention fix.
Julio: Brian T, ad hominem posts will not be tolerated.
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Brian T: Julio whatever, rat. If this is what you need to do in order to fil up that sad, lonely void inside of you, then so be it. It seems to be working.
Julio: Brian, are you a Roman Catholic?
Chuck Y: If any reasonable person picks up a Bible and actual y reads and comprehends... they won’t even get halfway through Genesis before it is clear that all that shit is made up. Best way to become an atheist is to actual y read the Bible. For real. Not the bits and pieces they cherry pick.
Spencer G: God does not answer knobshines.
Chuck Y: Spencer G, true. He has to actual y exist first. Why doesn’t he tel us that himself? Oh that’s right, we cannot possibly comprehend his ways.
Or, he doesn’t exist. I’m gonna go with that one. He can always show up and say hi, and then I’ll believe.
Gemma S: Spencer G, have u ever had any communication with God? Or was it “just a feeling”?
Spencer G: Gemma S, it was a profound dream after getting on my knees and praying real y hard.
Julio: Spencer G, who are you insulting with “knob shiners”? And what do you mean by “ profound dream” and “praying real y hard”?
Brent T: Spencer G, look in the mirror to see for yourself your claim.
Chuck Y: Brent T, he answered his own question as to why his God never has contacted him. He doesn’t talk to knobshines... lol Barry R: Prove God is real, and win the root of all evil in $20 denominations.
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Julio: Money is not the root of all evil. The story says that the love of money is. But even that is not true. It was the opinion of some delusional bigot a long time ago who lived a parasitic lifestyle at the expense of inattentive victims. Paul, his name in the Bible, was wrong once again.
Barry R: Julio, quantify your statement that Paul was wrong with evidence please. If the love of money is not the root of evil please give an example Julio: Barry R, I just did about Paul’s lifestyle at the expense f his inattentive victims. The root of all evil is not money: it is the God that Paul pushed and sold. Paul was a big liar, and for that I don’t trust him on anything. He preached poverty, because he was an envious character, hostile to progress, resentful against rich people, cynical, and intellectual y blind. Jesus told him that he should preach against wealthy rich people, because he [Jesus]
was a lazy bum, who never produced a day’s work in his short life. There is no record of Jesus doing anything as dignified work to earn an honest living. He preached old recycled moralisms to get free meals and free lodging from inattentive bystanders. Paul was the same. His preaching against wealth would have returned the world to primitivism and dark times. It is money that brings progress. Not the source of all evil. Paul was evil. But let me tell you this that you don’t know: 1 Timothy was not written by Paul. So, perhaps we can excuse him from the stupid blast about money.
Barry R, Julio, again unquantified statement followed by gas lighting. You say the root of all evil is not money but God. Proof?
Julio: Yahweh together with Satan - his half brother [Enki and Enlil] -
created this money system. It was Yahweh who cursed this world, and attacked Adam. He is responsible for all the evil in this world, not us his victims. Barry, you are born into this system, and you cannot do anything to change it, not even with the help of any God, much less Jehovah or Jesus or the Holy Ghost, three useless gods you fear. Everything is evil, including your God. You are born in a bad world, not of your making. So, stop protecting Paul!
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Donn H: I’ve been an atheist all my life, but back in 1973, my young wife was cheating on me and I was plotting to kill her lover or at least myself.
A young man handed me a Bible and suggested that I read about some guy named Jesus. Instead of buying a gun, I did exactly that and ended up forgiving my wife and never even meeting her lover or causing him any harm. I went on to marry another woman and now have three children and 5 grandchildren, and I honestly believe that just reading about that man who seemed to just love and understand everyone, including the people who executed him was enough to save my own life! Please donate the $20.00 you owe me to a worthy cause like ending Misogyny in the world.
Julio: Donn H, that story has some holes, so no $20, I lament...
Donn H, Julio I always try to express myself as well as possible. All I know is that my own life was saved, and if that young man hadn’t told me about Jesus, I might be dead, and my grandkids might not exist. By the way, my granddaughter wants to be an astronaut, but I doubt that she’ll wave to her grandma in Heaven as she flies by on her first trip to Mars. Julio, I did notice that you used the word intelligence. That’s my favorite subject along with the study of man’s quest to know how he got here.
Tien A: Yes Jesus was a savior. I was out walking on a hot day, when a guy pulled up and asked if I needed a lift. I gladly accepted the ride. He was driving a Honda Accord, his tag read Jesus. We’ve been friends ever since.
Aitch T: Julio, I think your money is safe, lol.
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39 – “Never question what your religion tel s you!”
66 comments
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Julio: Is this position a sign of intelligence? If it’s not a sign of intelligence, what is it? Muslims never question anything they are told in their religion!
Can you trust their intelligence? For instance: flying horses. All Muslims do believe in flying horses ... or else they will be called apostates, I heard.
It is bad in Islam not to believe in flying horses. So, muslims avoid not to believe in flying horses. Can one trust their intelligence, or is it a sign of intelligence to believe in flying horses? In Islam flying horses is central teaching. No flying horses no real islam. Flying horses is a vital teaching in Islam, I discovered. Do you want to convert and submit to Islam? You will have to believe in flying horses. No believing in flying horses no real muslim. The story goes like this: The prophet told muslims “I flew to Paradise on buraq, a winged horse!” Now all muslims say “Our prophet flew to Paradise on a winged horse!” That’s it. Nothing to debate, nothing to argue about, no need to question anything. The guy was taken to Paradise on the back of a winged beast through cosmic vacuum and neither the beast nor the prophet suffered any asphyxiation, period. One muslim told me it was a miracle. Another told me it was a quantum horse. Another asked me if Al ah could not take the guy any way he wanted. And so on and so forth. If you doubt or laugh at the situation you have a problem, not the muslims. For me, my observation, and my conclusion, the “trip”
to “Paradise” was from some hashish hal ucination. Prove me wrong and win $20 for the Salvation Army. I heard that excessive hashish fumes in the brain can create a chain of hal ucinations where the smokers can see
“Paradise”, “God, “flying horses” and much more. I don’t know, because I never tried any cannabis in my life. The tragic side of excessive cannabis in the brain and its consequent hal ucinations, visions, prophecies and more is that sometimes it ends up becoming part of some religion’s setup, am I wrong? If I’m wrong I apologise. I’m sorry. But prophets to me are all very suspicious guys. By principle I do not trust any prophet. Bottom line. Like, if a prophet tel s me that he went to Paradise on a flying horse by principle I don’t accept it. Probably I will tell the prophet to get lost.
Luckily, I never had any prophet tell me that. Most prophets I knew were more worried with Armageddon than with flying horses.
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Laila J: Don’t forget their opium dens, they exist still today, opium mania!
Ya, I bet a head full of that could cause “The moon was split in half and put back together by some man-god creature?” I don’t remember who put it “back together” but someone supposedly did. Ya, that’s some serious
“revelations” or the worst baloney ever invented, lol. Like ants talking and the oceans don’t mix. Sounds like the first time my friends and I got stoned. Stuff you can’t make out the meaning of, that you wrote down, like “god’s monkey army”, LOL, I know, that’s the Hindus.
Julio: Laila J, You’re not wrong, LOL! Cannabis has helped religions to assemble a large collection of absurdities.
Brian T: Wow, look at all these consecutive replies to yourself. Sad. So, is that your shtick? When nobody answers your rambling tirades, you simply (and fraudulently) garner attention by claiming to donate to charitable organizations?
Julio: Brian T, LOL, fixed it, relax.
Brian T: Julio, nah, you haven’t fixed it. You have a habit of doing this and yet, you don’t provide proof of your donations. As a matter of fact, you have stated several times, in other conversations, that you are financial y
“struggling”, so I don’t know how you can keep coming onto a random religious debate forum and offer to provide actual monetary donations for replies/attention. It screams fraud to me.
Julio:Brian T, Sorry for the situation. Yes, struggling, but I can borrow $20
from a friend, can I not?
Laila J: Brian T, who are you calling “nobody”?! lol Brian T: Laila J, I was the first to comment, excluding his long string of replies to himself. Me stating “nobody” isn’t a slight to anybody else.
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Julio: Brian T, okay, point taken. I fixed the “string” and converted it into one single reply. Are you happy now?
Laila J: Hey Julio, for what it’s worth, I thought the donation thing was real y very hilarious. Don’t listen to that mean ol’ ( looks like young) guy.
You have great material. Don’t let anyone tell you any different or rain on your parade, yaddity yaddity..blah blah blah. lol Darwin P: “Modern Americans behave as if intelligence were some sort of hide hideous deformity.”
Maxwell S: Am glad am an atheist because I have questioned religion so many times and it couldn’t give me any evidence or proof.
Julio: Maxwell S, Religion is ruled by superstitions, firstly. Secondly, by commerce with those superstitions.
Maxwell S: Julio, that’s so true.
Julio: All religions convert intelligence into superstition, sadly, is it not?
Jim G: Julio, atheism being the most egregious offender. Blind fideism.
Group-think religious zealotry. A Neo-pagan earth worship cult.
Julio: Jim G, atheists will not applaud your assault on their convictions, but more importantly, do you believe in flying horses yourself, as a matter of curiosity?
Jim G: Julio; do you believe in purple unicorns that poop frozen yogurt as the cause of the universe? That’s your story right? What’s your favorite flavor again?
Julio: Jim G, first of all I don’t believe that there are purple unicorns that poop frozen yogurt, when did I say such a ridiculous thing, lol? Secondly, 275
no universe was caused by any pooping. Thirdly, stop posting childish stuff.
Raymond D: Julio, sooo, what’s the alternative explanation not likely to be mocked?
Jim G: Julio; as soon as you do. You believe in fairy dust. You’re the one with fideistic faith. I’m impressed with your loyalty to your religion.
David B: Jim G, oh my... I’ll stop when you do... something that is common around the age of three, otherwise physical y mature inept minds.
Julio: Raymond D, alternative to what, to superstitions...?
Stephen H: No universe was caused by pooping, this guy is hilarious.
Julio: By the way, intelligent folks: Both muslims and christians believe in flying horses. There is a historical reason for that, did you know? Want to know what leads those unfortunate victims of religion to believe in flying horses? I can tell you.
Tapiwa T: But you were given that brain to reason, and questioning is part of reasoning, so no it’s not.
Jun D: The religious leaders and their forefathers, the goat herders, are the intelligent ones. Church members are conditioned not to learn anything contrary to their church and Bible teachings, making them highly ignorant and gullible.
Julio: Very much true. Religion does kill brain cel s and neurons, turning the victims into jel yfish, spineless, intellectual midgets, sadly.
Intelligence is lost in religion. Examples abound, one being the story that some prophet went to Paradise on a flying horse across vacuum without suffering any asphyxiation. It’s terrible. Religion does indeed hurt 276
intelligence, perspicacity, discernment.
Steve S: Jun D, for the most part, I agree. Yet, I wouldn’t attach ‘goat hearders’ to the equation. Most of the writers of the OT were of an elite group among the Israelites who highly redacted the text.
Jun D: Steve S, then they are worse than the goat herders, for they should know better but don’t.
Steve S: Jun D, using that sense, yes.
Jim G: Atheists never question their religious convictions. A sign of stupidity.
Bil y K: Jim G, all religions are plain stupidity and bullShit.
Jim G: Bil y K, but none so much as atheism.
David B: Jim G, don’t choke on the sanctimony.
Julio: You started badly this morning, by your habitual misfiring, lol.
Stop it, before you upset somebody seriously and start a nasty shoe-throwing battle.
Jim G: Julio, nobody is stopping anything except you. Hopeful y. That would be awesome.
Julio: Mmm... well it is apparent that you don’t appreciate my posts... am I wrong?
Dave J: Theism is told to never question their gods all because the creators of their religions never wanted the truth to come out.
David B: Dave J, one can’t question god... it’d defeat the entire faith like 277
a cancer. They had to invest in massive BS just to seem credible several thousand years ago. The real BS is the current flock who real y do believe the magic still works like it did before light bulbs.
Dave J: David B, exactly, the flock of sheep follows their imaginary shepherd.
Eliza S: David B, faith is a cancer! It is, by definition, belief without evidence. One can have faith in people, but that is not faith if they have already proven themselves to him; that is more confidence than faith.
Julio: Eliza S, faith among the Christians is defined in Hebrews 11:1, the coarsest definition I’ve found in the whole Bible. “Faith is to believe in invisible things!” [KJV] They call their God a thing, LOL!
Steve S: Dave J, when I was religious, I never realized that those good people in the church, whom I thought were holy, would also not tell me critical points regarding the reality of what I was being taught. It took stepping out of the religion itself for an outside point of view to show me that, in particular, they didn’t want me to know.
Rob C: Purpose is all about obedience. Religion is the most effective form of slavery. It can make people pray 5 times a day, thank a fantasy being for everything over and over and give 10% of their income to a tyrannical institution without question.
Soetiran K: You have to question everything, the beginning of science.
Paul E: Not questioning everything is the foundation of indoctrination.
Eliza S: No way! The brain does not lie to you! You know what you know.
Believing and knowing are not always the same, if ever.
Mahmud H: I know what my religion tel s me. You see them as a visitor, 278
not to learn what this religion is saying. You believe media, you trust some fake news so you think that religion is bul shit.
Julio: If religion is not a dangerous activity what is it? The intelligent student is intelligent enough to see that religion is a force for division.
Also, religion has never contributed for the betterment of humankind. In other words, religion was, is, and will always be a toxic tree of poisonous fruit.
Mahmud H: Julio, wel , I believe Islam. And I never saw anything heinous for mankind in the Quran or the hadid. Trust me or not, but this is true.
How you are explaining Islam I never have seen them before. I have read Quran and Hadid (Bukhari) and there I didn’t find anything that says your thoughts. It looks like you are saying what your mind is encouraging you, no matter for you to consider those sentences before saying them.
I am cool, man. Please tell me what part is looking dangerous in Islamic activity?
Julio: The part that divides everything into factions, cults, conflicts, even among muslims killing one another for trivial disagreements on stories men invented. Also, the quran is full of violence, but if you never noticed it then you are intellectual y blind or worse. When you read the quran without preconceived instructions and opinions, you quickly discover that the book is human expedient, fabrication, and forgery.
Dustin B: People love being god’s royal subjects. It frees them from any personal responsibility.
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40 – Jesus’ prophecies: which one the biggest flop?
45 comments
Julio: He invented many prophecies, but there is one that makes you laugh for its stupid side. It’s in Matthew 24, and has to do with a 279
geocentric universe and a flat Earth Jesus believed. $20 for the Salvation Army if you find it.
Spencer G: Julio the earth is flat though.
Julio: Spencer G, in your flat brain...? Christians believe every little
“prophecy” their saviour put out, but for an intelligent student al prophecies were flops, no exceptions. All the prophecies attributed to some guru called “Jesus-of-Nazareth” are propaganda stunts in books handwritten after the events, or too coarse to be taken seriously. The Jesus of the canonical gospels was a big liar. There are big and small lies, but the whole story is nothing but a massive lie. There are many lies in the lips of Jesus. He even lied about the Devil. One occasion he told his small-brain-low-IQ disciples that he saw the Devil falling from the sky like thunder lightning! Luke 10. That’s very stupid. I always laugh at this ridiculous submission. Lightning is at the speed of light. Obviously none of his followers understood the lie. But Jesus had Superman vision, and in a split second could identify Satan in that flash of lightning. There are many absurdities pushed by Jesus. The sad side is believers believing al that tripe.
Terence M: This one, it ought to have discouraged those still waiting in vain. Matthew 16:28: “Verily I say unto you, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.” That didn’t happen did it?
Julio: Terence, that is perhaps the most laughable we get in the collection.
Julio: Let me give you a strong clue: there is a verse with the prophecy that in the geocentric canopy above something will fall from there. Think about it. It is the most ridiculous of all prophecies ever uttered by these liars called prophets of holy books.
Luke P: Terence M, yes. It happened and the Kingdom continues on to 280
this day. It is an everlasting kingdom.
Terence M: Luke P, this is all very wel , however you will notice in the verse I cited earlier ‘they will see the son of man coming’ Was he seen arriving? If so, why do almost all Christians claim he is yet to return? A little confusing.
Julio: Luke P, Jesus lied. Initial y the kingdom was a physical situation, and the king a human being that would need a place to defecate, nothing supernatural where the king never emptied his bowels. Real Bible study is when you firstly suspect that the story is a lie. Then you move on from there.
Luke P: Terence M, you are asking exactly the right questions.
Unfortunately, almost all Christians are wrong. (See, you were right about that all along). I would recommend looking into Preterism.
Terence M: Luke P, ‘almost all Christians are wrong’ That’s quite a statement, what makes your view of Christianity ‘right?’ What do you know that they don’t? I’m pretty sure most of them will disagree with you, with over 45,000 mostly incompatible denominations of the Christian cult, it’s very confusing for someone like me (never been a believer) if Christians can’t even agree among themselves.
Aitch T: A prophecy is just a wild guess. I don’t remember any of the wel known Bronze Age prophets telling us that sometime in the future there will be guns, electricity, radio, television, motor cars, jet travel, space travel, Internet, bulldozers, flushing toilets, elevators, robots, etc., etc.
Prophets? My arse.
Rob C: Aitch T, on what day did god create the iPhone?
Donald W: Rob C, the horrible molester genocidal mythological delusional fictional fairy tale pixie unicorn magical sky daddy in the 281
sky which is what atheist call the Invisible Everlasting Almighty God, created the iPhone on the third day of creation when He created the earth as written in the mythological delusional fictional fairy tale book which is what atheist call the Holy Bible in Genesis 1:9-13.
Rob C: Donald W, you got god’s phone number?
Donald W, Rob C, yes. It’s Matthew 11:28-30, Acts 2:38. Available to al nations of people here on Earth 24\7.
Julio: Donald don’t talk crap or you will be banned, last warning.
Wes C: The worst for me is him telling his friends that he was returning before the current generation passed.
Ron C: All his prophecies are stories he made up.
Julio: Here it is, the biggest flop in that collection of prophetic absurdities by Jesus: “...and the stars shall fall from heaven...” There you have it -
the most absurd prophecy ever uttered by a prophet! Matthew 24:29.
Jesus believed in a geocentric universe, where stars could fall from heaven, because heaven was the spherical canopy above the stationary center, planet Earth. Now, now! Here come the rabid fanatics trying to
“spiritualise” or allegorise what for Jesus was material substance, stars being bal s of fire that could fall from heaven to Earth as punishment by his Father in heaven. Jesus, get lost, idiot. Jesus, too young, too stupid, too idiotic, stubborn, lips full of lies.
Peter N: Julio, God spread out the heavens, stretching them out like a curtain. (See, e.g., Job 9:8; Psalm 104:2; Isaiah 40:22 & 42:5 & 45:12.) ...
all knowing God thought that the Universe was two dimensional.
Julio: “... and the stars shall fall from the sky...”! That’s the worst one!
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